Duraspark conversion KISS Keep It Simple Stangers

Daze · 05-13-2008, 11:12 AM

Yesterday I spent about an hour helping my dad switch from points to duraspark on his 72 ford with a 351W. I had done the swap before on my 62 Galaxie but before I did the swap this time I did a bit of research because I new there were lots of opinions on how to make the swap. What I found was a lot of people disagreeing as to what the best way to do it was. I had MustangSteve's original drawing from his web page where the white and read get spliced in to the brown (that is how my Galaxie is hooked up) and I had Steve's new drawing which involves running a new wire from the ignition switch to the box and coil to by pas the resistance wire, for a full 12 volts, as well as a couple of others that use relays. All in all the old ways and the new ways are the "hard" way (not that running a few wires, or hooking up a relay is that hard) my dad has an MSD 6A box on his truck and so all I did was hook the magnetic pickups from the MSD to two of the wirs coming out of the distributor and then the original + from the coil went to the red wire on the MSD box, the output wires from the MSD box went to coil and of course power from the MSD box to the battery . That was it, it was done. Took about 10 minutes to hook up including soldering an original Ford plug that plugs in to the distributor to the green and vilote wire supplied by MSD (if you really want it to be simple MSD sells this pigtail ready made) and the rest of the hour was timing, tuning and BSing An way the MSD box has a cranking voltage range of 9-18V and a run voltage range of 5-18V sooooo you can remove the pink wire, you can use the pink wire, it really doesn't matter and eliminates all the extra wires needed to supply a full 12 volts to the ignition box. Of course the MSD box is around $150.00 but the "good" stock ignition control module was $60.00 so almost half and the benefits of the 6A box are more than worth the extra $90.00 spent. Any way thought I would post because in my research I read lots of questions/views about the duraspark swap especially in relation to the resistance wire and that you should or should not bypass it and since a lot of people will be running the MSD box anyway this sure makes things simple and takes out all the questions/options/opinions/headaches.

65Coupester · 05-13-2008, 01:04 PM

The Summit racing box hooks up the exact same way. I just followed the instructions that came with it. BTW, I believe that the Summit box is MSD.

The resistor wire doesn't matter because that wire only powers the points or electronic points eliminators(Pertronix,Dura), which only provide a 'signal' to the MSD box.
The power for the coil actually comes from the MSD box and that is supplied directly from 12 volts as you described.

If all else fails, read the instructions.

Daze · 05-13-2008, 01:24 PM

The MSD instructions show two ways to do it, you can do it as I did or you can also hook it up with the duraspark box and simply use the factory coil wires to trigger the MSD. My original thinking was two do it the second way, with the factory module so that if the MSD box were to fail you could unhook it along side the road and drive away, but the thing is the only time I have herd of an MSD box failing is if it got to hot or was not disconnected during welding, sooo I decided, why even mess with the factory module.

Starfury · 05-13-2008, 06:29 PM

Hm, that's nifty. Not sure I agree with it being worth the extra $90 (more, actually, if you want to use magnetic pickups)for most daily drivers, but at least it's easy to hook up.

Daze · 05-13-2008, 07:17 PM

Quote:

ORIGINAL: Starfury
Hm, that's nifty.Â* Not sure I agree with it being worth the extra $90 (more, actually, if you want to use magnetic pickups)Â*for most daily drivers, but at least it's easy to hook up.

IMHO an MSD box is worth more than the $150.00 the unit costs for any and all kinds of cars, points or duraspark. My bone stock 83 F150, 62 Galaxie, high performance 64.5 Mustang and my wife's bone stock and very tired 66 Mustang before we sold it ALL had them and the difference in performance increases and MPG was amazing. I picked up 2-3 MPG per vehickle, and more power. Just to give you an example my Mustang is set up with blue LEDs that light up when the secondaries on my carb open so that I can see when I am wasting gas for fun.

When I first put the car together it did not have the MSD box. When I shifted down and hit the gas to pass the blue lights would come on. After the MSD install I could shift down, hit the gas and get the same power as before with out having to give it enough gas to make the secondaries come open, and when the secondaries did come open it was like having a complete next level of power. I had a friend who had a 69 Dodge cornet that went through points every 6 months and no matter what you did it would not run smooth at idle. As soon as I convinced him to install an MSD box the car smoothed out, he quit burning through points and picked up 3 MPG. Also I saw a display once that had two electrodes and the distance between them could be adjusted and when you flipped on the machine a spark jumped between the two electrodes. There were 2 modes: standard ignition, and MSD 6A box. In standard there was a little orange spark that could not be made any longer than about 3/16". In MSD mode the arc was a brilliant blue white, at lest three times a wide as the first spark and I was able to move the electrodes over 1/2" apart before the arc failed. And with an MSD box I have never fouled a set of plugs even when my carb was to rich. In case you are wondering I really like my MSD box

Now don't get me wrong the Duraspark module is a good option especially on a tight budget, but if you want a little extra performance the MSD box is well worth the extra $$ At least thats my opinion

Starfury · 05-13-2008, 07:57 PM

Not to be contrary, but if you're getting a dull orange spark, something's wrong:P I get a nice hot blue spark with my 40kV blaster 2 coil at .045" gap, and you should still get a pretty decent blue spark from even a stock coil with working points or an electronic upgrade. Hell, even my '79 Vespa P125 shoots a good blue spark across .030", and it's 6V and has points and runs off a magneto. Spark intensity is mostly a function of the coil, not the ignition module. I've seen spark testers hooked up to HEI setups that will shoot a blue spark across a 3 inch gap between electrodes just spinning the distributor by hand.

I canunderstand a mileage/performance increase versus straight points, because points suck and they start wearing the first time you fire the car up. But how would that compare with something like a basic Pertronix conversion? Or is that what you started with on the Mustangs?

PS: Thanks again for the help with the CSRP kit

65Coupester · 05-13-2008, 08:32 PM

I agree with Daze on the CD box. It will smooth out idle and improve general performance.
2 main reasons:
1. Multiple sparks/compression stroke. Under 3000 RPM.
2. CD Box shoots at least 300 Volts through the coil primary creating a 'fast' high voltage spark that will jump .045 gap on any motor.
I am not brand loyal though. The Summit box is 50 bucks cheaper and electronically equivalent.

Quote:

But how would that compare with something like a basic Pertronix conversion?

The difference is night and day.
Pertronix is simply a solid state switch. It will do no better than a new set of points. The only real advantage is convience. Its like always having new points.

The CD box is a whole different principle.

It also has the advantage that points will barely wear with a CD box. The reason why is that very little current flows through the points with a CD box, therefor there is little wear on the contacts. The points simply provide a low voltage/current 'signal' to the CD box. The box provides high voltage/current to the coil.

For me - I would spend the money on a CDI rather than points eliminator.

Daze · 05-13-2008, 09:58 PM

Quote:

ORIGINAL: Starfury

Not to be contrary,

If I didn't know any better I would think you like to be contrary to my posts

Well I will conseed and we can completely eliminate the display I saw as a reason for the MSD box, I mean it was an MSD marketing tool so who knows what the "stock" spark was, stock lawn mower maybe

Quote:

ORIGINAL: Starfury
PS: Thanks again for the help with the CSRP kit

My pleasure!!! If I can ever help you or any one else for that matter with any thing, sales related or not please don't hesitate to ask. Any thing I can do to help further this hobby is in my opinion worth doing.

Starfury · 05-14-2008, 01:07 AM

I don't post simply to be contrary, I really do like to hear the answers to the questions I ask

There's a big difference between upgrading to an MSD box from worn points versus going from a working Ignitor II unit to the MSD box. I do find your test with the LED's hooked to the secondaries very interesting, though. That's probably the most functional test I've ever heard of an MSD upgrade. Dyno tests often don't show improvements in street manners, but that's a surefire way to know how well the engine's running.

Daze · 05-14-2008, 09:11 AM

I don't know if this helps or not, but my 83 F150 has duraspark, came that way from the factory. I had it for a few months before added the MSD box and when I went from no MSD to having the MSD I did notice an over all improvement in the way the truck ran especially in colder weather (we have a little bit of that here in MT) With the hotter ignition there was less warm up time on cold mornings and the truck ran smoother before it achieved running tempriture.