I currently have a 2000 BMW M5 and I am getting very sick of the over inflated prices involved with owning this car. Last trip to dealer they wanted $750 to change out the thermostat. I am looking at a '05 Mustang GT supercharged or an '04 Mustang Cobra. I like the look and interior room of the '05, but I like the idea that the Cobra's engine was designed to handle the Supercharger. Which one would give better perfromance?

03-04 Cobra, the Cobra motor is much MUCH more capable than the 3V 4.6 in the new GT's. But I'd probably keep the M5.

The forged Cobra block will hold mor power from the get go. However you have to buy a used Cobra. They are great but are nowhere as refined as the S197.
Many people have fast S197s that can beat Cobras but to achieve numbers well over 500RWHP safely you shouldupgrade forged rods and pistons in a 3-valve.

^^^ +1

I don't mind a slightly used Cobra. I am 2.5 hrs from the nearest certified BMW M Technician. It is getting to be a real pain every time I have to have my car worked on. I had a 2000 GT and was pretty happy with it. There are a ton of aftermarket accessories at a reasonable price. I am looking at new OEM wheels for my M5, $1,100 each. I am thinking I would have more fun building a Mustang (Cobra) than maintaining an M5.

What is an S197?

ORIGINAL: jcdavis
What is an S197?


S197 is the model code for this generation of Mustang. similar to how bmw has E46, E40, etc... or how VW has MK3, MK4, etc...

ORIGINAL: jcdavis

I don't mind a slightly used Cobra. I am 2.5 hrs from the nearest certified BMW M Technician. It is getting to be a real pain every time I have to have my car worked on. I had a 2000 GT and was pretty happy with it. There are a ton of aftermarket accessories at a reasonable price. I am looking at new OEM wheels for my M5, $1,100 each. I am thinking I would have more fun building a Mustang (Cobra) than maintaining an M5.

What is an S197?


The S197 is the 05+ Mustang. The 03/04 Cobras known as Terminators are awesome beasts with potential out the wazoo. They have a 4v vs 3v in the 05+

Get the 04 cobra for performanace and fun. I love my 07 SC GT, I bought it new and installed the blower. Bought the car on an impulse, going to the car lot is 100 times harder than a pet store. I always bring something home.

In hindsight I should have bought a Cobra, but big deal I still have a great car.

Here is what I would have done had I got a Cobra, in no particular order.

-Solid rear axle
-MGW shifter
-3.4L whipple
-New fuel system
-Larger HE
-Larger intercooler res.
-Sparco seats
-Roll cage
-Alum DS
-Mcloed Twin disc clutch
-298ci forged/stroked block
-Black 03 Cobra relica wheels (Would have got a Sonic Blue car)

Put out about 650+rwhp on pump gas, race gas ???.

What's the cost of the mods that it would take to get the 650hp you are talking about?

ORIGINAL: MustangGT0405

Get the 04 cobra for performanace and fun. I love my 07 SC GT, I bought it new and installed the blower. Bought the car on an impulse, going to the car lot is 100 times harder than a pet store. I always bring something home.

In hindsight I should have bought a Cobra, but big deal I still have a great car.

Here is what I would have done had I got a Cobra, in no particular order.

-Solid rear axle
-MGW shifter
-3.4L whipple
-New fuel system
-Larger HE
-Larger intercooler res.
-Sparco seats
-Roll cage
-Alum DS
-Mcloed Twin disc clutch
-298ci forged/stroked block
-Black 03 Cobra relica wheels (Would have got a Sonic Blue car)

Put out about 650+rwhp on pump gas, race gas ???.







so by the time you do all those mods on a cobra, you can buy a used GT (easily 8K cheaper than a 03 cobra) and do the SAME mods.

My point is ... if you're going that far in a cobra is absolutelly pointles buying one, you can do that in a 05GT and the baseline will be cheaper, and the results will be the same.

not so sure on used S197 being cheaper slighty modded Termi's can be had for around 22,000-21,000 and that puts you at about the same price as a brand new gt but the termi is rated at 390hp with forged internals and the stock GT is well a stock gt rated at 300hp which one would you choose

thats a question answered by what you want to. i think the termin would have been better for me only because i have ended up only using the car for racing. i bought a brand new truck so i could drive and tow the mustang around. if i had known it would of turned into this i would have bought a cobra. now one of my good friends has an 04 cobra and he says he wished he bought an 05 and modded, he loves the room and the design and feel of the car, so its all dependent on what your goals are going to be with the car. a modded 05+ plus with blower or bolt ons with apearance work is better looking to me than a cobra, however a cobra is bad ass, in looks and is stock power.

Ifthe OPwants a cobra with 450rwhp, or a S197 with 450rwhp, I would say go S197.

If they want crazy power I would go Cobra. It is already forged, and will respond great to mods for much less than a GT.

I like to go crazy with cars but I do it in small steps over a long period, since I dont have tons of $$.

With a cobra for $1k you can get 80rwhp easy, and keep growing from there.

As far as pricing the mods I listed, I never really have but I figure if you shopped well you could do it for $10-$13k. But that is just a guess.

Good luck. Either way will be fun, I just think the Cobra supports major mods better. Just forging a 3 valve will cost you like $7k, so...

The good thing about the cobra is most SVT owners take good care of there cars. Low Miles as well. They are easy to find that way.

They will hold there value allot stronger and you will have a 4 valve supercharged car out of the box, which is nice. You can pick up one for about 25k with low miles. Sense you said you just want 450 then I would just do basic bolt ons such as an X Pipe, Intake, Pulley and Tune if it does not have on all ready.

Now for about 3,200 you can do the whipple upgrade for it and turn that baby into a beast but I am sure like any other mod that give you more power it is the same with the Cobra's you will probably run into more issues with fuel and such.

The good thing about the cobra is its a solid car all ready with good suspension and a good rear end.

The pro's that I have found with my S197 is that the stock rear end has lasted with some good abuse as well as the stock 5spd. With only a clutch, flywheel and shifter upgrade.

You can ask any person that has done mods such as a S/C you will end up spending more money then planned easily.

Test drive both and then decide.

Once you're used to the S197 interior and the SEATS its really hard to go a gen back ...

really i love the seats in the 04 Cobra's

I am acutally looking to replace mine with solid black leather CR1's

I hate the leather seats in the S197. At least my 06 ones. They are the WORST seats I have ever sat in in a car. Leather is supposed to be luxurious, not like sitting on a block of wood. And don't give me that crap about it's a mustang not a jaguar. After about 15min I'm ready to get out. Ever since I got this car my middle back stays sore. I have adjusted the seat a lot too.

My old '95 V6 mustang with cloth seats were quite nice. They were soft and hugged your back. Maybe the cloth seats in the S197 are better, I don't know.

Once I sat in the seats of an 03 or 04 Mach 1 and from what I remember they felt pretty good. But I did not drive the car, I only sat in them for maybe 1 minute at the dealer so it's hard to say if they really were better.

ORIGINAL: MustangGT0405

IfÂ*the OPÂ*wants a cobra with 450rwhp, or a S197 with 450rwhp, I would say go S197.

If they want crazy power I would go Cobra.Â* It is already forged, and will respond great to mods for much less than a GT.

I like to go crazy with cars but I do it in small steps over a long period, since I dont have tons of $$.

With a cobra for $1k you can get 80rwhp easy, and keep growing from there.

As far as pricing the mods I listed, I never really have but I figure if you shopped well you could do it for $10-$13k.Â* But that is just a guess.

Good luck.Â* Either way will be fun, I just think the Cobra supports major mods better.Â* Just forging a 3 valve will cost you like $7k, so...




+1

$$ for dollar the cobra will make more power. You just have to build it right. Build the suspension/ ditch the IRS and buy a whipple. Parts are getting cheaper for cobras and the motor was built by gods.......Our motor was built by capable idiots

ORIGINAL: jcdavis

What's the cost of the mods that it would take to get the 650hp you are talking about?

I am almost to 650rwhp in my s197 it will cost you 14k minimum to get there if you need add the cost of a supercharger (3.4L whipple) and then you need to upgrade the tranny, so say 19k.

Its funny how so many people with s197's will tell someone elseto get a cobra instead of an s197... It's not like theres too much of a price difference, why didn't you get one then?

You are coming to the s197 specific forum and asking a loaded question. I am all about the retro styling of the s197s and do not particularly care for the body style of the 04 Cobra. However, I respect the Cobra (especially those with spoiler deletes ;)) and its powerful engine. But for the money, you could build the s197 just how you want it.

I am totally biased. S197 all the way. They are sexy!

strictly for performance the Termi/Cobra - a blower swap will gain big HP

for an overall better car (IMHO) the S197/05+

or for a crazy idea... if you own an M5 (new @ purchase?) get a GT500 (can be found at sticker) and then you'll really have options on power!

http://www.mustangforums.com/m_4779896/mpage_1/key_/tm.htm#4779896

I'm sure you'll find alot of good content in here, input from both owners

I didn'tbuy one because I was overseas when they were new. I don't buy used cars, It's like sharing toilet paper.



ORIGINAL: SONICBOOST3

Its funny how so many people with s197's will tell someone elseto get a cobra instead of an s197... It's not like theres too much of a price difference, why didn't you get one then?

ORIGINAL: blueherd02gt

I didn'tbuy one because I was overseas when they were new. I don't buy used cars, It's like sharing toilet paper.



I wouldn't say that, great deals can be had used if you know anything about cars and use a little patience and common sense.

Forget both. Go with the GT500 instead.

Well, I dont know much about the "terminator". But I recently smoked a presumably stock 04 svt cobra from a roll in 2nd through third. I have Brenspeeds stage one saleen. I think its safe to say it would have been even worse had it been from the hole cause I run DR's and the cobra was on street tires. I really dont know what advice to give you, I just know the feeling I had when I saw the look on that guys face was priceless. He egged the "race" because he was so sure he had me beat, and when I put him down like that I think he was really hurt... Hah[8D]. But that being said, I have a car that cost me 28K new (08)and about 8k into mods, so thats around 36k, a cobra with that much into it would kill me and I know it. But, it was priceless none the less. Good luck, and welcome to the forum.

Im getting a 08' GT in August, and I was torn between a cobra and a GT as well, but can say this, after reading this, I'll probably go with the GT, to me the GT seems like you can make it just as fast as a Cobra, but honstly, I think going past 500 HP is a little overboard ( I know you guys would disagree). I making your car individual is what having a 'stang is all about. If I cant beat a cobra, so what, if smoke a cobra, Im gonna jump for joy, but either way, my car is my car....now if I could get a GT500 KR..........

03/04 Cobra all the way. I have had an 07 GT for almost 2 years now, and had three previous Mustangs before this one.......I am notoverly impressed with these cars. They look cool, have some decent hardware, but as a performance car aren't in the same leauge as a Cobra. The seats suck and thegauges are awful for a performance car.

why not just get the saleen? i think its like the S 351 or something thats supercharged with forged internals...??

ORIGINAL: AWESOMO 4000

03/04 Cobra all the way. I have had an 07 GT for almost 2 years now, and had three previous Mustangs before this one.......I am notoverly impressed with these cars. They look cool, have some decent hardware, but as a performance car aren't in the same leauge as a Cobra. The seats suck and thegauges are awful for a performance car.




Then sell your piece of crap s197 and get a 03/04 cobra...

You get an 05 SC GT but the thing is does the GT still have stock suspension, and all the other supporting mods to help the car transfer that power?

A stock 05 GT with just a SC I give it to the Cobra. Now if you beef up the rear suspension, and gears and have a good S/C kit then its all most equal. Now the thing is that Forged block mmm yeah thats a taker and duel over head cams.

Both are just great cars but if I could do it all over again I would of did the same thing :) the GT500 was just way to much money right away and I needed a car in 05 not 07.

Both cars look killer but if built right out cars own for style and looks there is no comparision inside and out. Engine wise yeah the cobra has us. Shoot why not do best of both worlds. Just put an 04 block in our 05 and wha la :) thats what I opted for.

I'm sure the OP has chosen by now or isn't around anymore..(month old thread) but.. as far as the gauges go.. I think they are cool and unique.. very retro style.. and.. if it really is a toss up to you between the looks of the 03-04 cobra vs the looks of the new s197s then go for the cobra.. I honestly hated the looks of the 99-2004 mustangs.. I even had a friend that had a 95 mustang was going to buy a(this was in 99) 2000 cobra.. but after seeing the new body style he bought a 2000 trans am instead.. I know there are others that felt the same way..

Seats? I think the leather seats are fairly comfortable(my friend has leather in his, and i go for rides with him)... but I don't like leather so I got cloth.. and yes. the seats aren't the most comfortable but I've sat in much worse.. I think the seats in most honda/toyota/subaru cars are pretty uncomfortable.. heck.. most cars for less than 30,000 aren't as comfortable as the seats in a more luxurious car.. If it bothers you that much you can replace them with lighter, more comfortable seats for relatively very little money.. about $100 a piece i believe was the price.

anyway..

1) If looks are a tossup go with the cobra.. otherwise go with the one you like the looks of the best.. because you can make an s197 really fast too.

2) If you want cheapest route to 700rwhp Cobra will do it

3) if you want to just stick to sub 500rwhp I'd choose the S197 if looks go either way. (so you can have a brand new car)

I would say go with the cobra. I had an 06 gt that was supercharged and all that other good stuff and then traded it in for the cobra, which I wish I would have just got the cobra from the beginning. The only thing I liked about my 06 was it had a stiffer suspension. And it is a lot cheaper to do add performance to the cobra than the newer ones.

if you put the same setup of the terminator on an s197 it'll outrun and have more power than the terminator. i love the gauges and seats in my s197. these have much more potential than what the last generation mustangs had. tune it and blow it and you'll look better and be faster

Personally I love the looks and power potential of the terminator and alot of my friends ask why I bought a new mustang instead of a terminator. I just tell them the terminators still have a fox chassis and even though they are fun to drive its not a very comfortable car. To me the s197's are more lincoln like compared to sn-95's. If you want raw fun power go with the terminator, but if you want a more refined comfortable mustang that can be made fastget the s197.