There is no replacement for displacement. The ls1's that came out in 99 were 5.7 liter(347ci) motors. I dont understand why ford is sticking with the 5.4(329ci) so tight. The corvette's now have 427ci motors. Ford wouldn't need a supercharger either if they would up the liters and design aluminum heads that would help them get what they need. I am around nuthin but chevy guys and to be honest ford cannot compete with chevy unless the come with something else. Every since the ls1 has come out ford has been more about designing than horsepower. A stock 99 camaro z28 will blow away a stock 99 gt. This is what you hear from chevy guys "Ford has to make the horsepower that chevy makes with a supercharger. What happens when the chevy adds a supercharger(2009 chevrolet corvette z06)?." I hear this 3,4,5 times a week. I have an idea for the 2009 ford mustang gt. Take a 5.8 liter ford motor good heads, mild cam, bigger injectors, better mass air, bigger throttle body, delete the back seat(real sports cars dont need back seats too much weight), come out with a t-top version along with a convertible. For the 2009 shelby use exact same motor but design as a turbo motor. Make the compression low so you can put at least 10 pounds of boost into the stock motor. This will leave room for the consumer to modify an already fast sports car as chevys do. I am a MUSTANG MAN and this chevy crap is getting out of hand. If ford waits to long we will never catch them.
Well...instead of trying to perfect a pushrod since the inception like chevy, ford has dabled in more progressive technology. I don't know if you will notice something, but if chevy made the same displacement engine...they tend to be lower horsepower than ford engines. Ford doesn't make huge production engines, because they chose not to. Furthermore, who cares if you use a supercharger to make your power? Displacement isn't always that big of a deal. Look at the supra, they can strap jet engine sized turbo's onto em and make well over 1000hp plus they are lighter. If you have to have low end torque, you will hate the smaller displacement engines...but if you want to feel like you're taking off in a jet at higher rpm....have a little faith. Plus, you can always get nitrous systems for turbo'd engines that shoot a 50 shot at low rpm to get em spooled by 2000 rpm....then ur pulling till redline.
I heard on the 2010 forums that project was scrapped once the CAFE standards were put in place.
I heard that also. I think these new CAFE standards is going to kill this current horsepower war that is going on now. That would suck if the mid 70's came back in horsepower terms.
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05 GT Satin Silver Pypes Violater Axle-Back JLT CAI and SCT 91 Tune by Brenspeed
I heard on the 2010 forums that project was scrapped once the CAFE standards were put in place.
I heard that also. I think these new CAFE standards is going to kill this current horsepower war that is going on now. That would suck if the mid 70's came back in horsepower terms.
I wouldn't count on it, this time around we have direct injection, cylinder deactivation, VVT, etc etc etc. However, Chevy will probably have a hard time with their ancient push rod crap...thats why the new c7 vette is supposedly getting a 400 or less horsepower 4.9l (it will be 400 lbs lighter tho). This is where ford will shine, we have had practice at making efficient engines...whereas chevy has kinda been using the same old bag of tricks for 20 years...
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Joined: 11/28/2005 From: Northern VA Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: LSGun98
quote:
ORIGINAL: CataclysmGT
A 4.6 is going to be hard to compete against at 400hp 6.0. But, the Camaro is going to have a hard time competing against the price point of the Stang.
chevy is not dropping a 6.0 LS2 in the new camaro. the LS2 is "supposively" going out of mass marketing. ive heard rumors of the LS3 6.3L stepping in but nothing is for sure yet. theres more certainty of what the challenger is going to have.. and its coming out before the new fbody.
Yes, the LS2 will be retired. The New Camaro may start out in 09 with the L76 6.0L that is offered in the G8 Pontiac now rated at 361hp but the camaro version may have 400hp or the LS3 6.2L at 425hp. The V6 looks like it may have the Northstar 3.8L 300hp DI GM has also stated that the Camaro will Cost the same as the Mustang, maybe 1500 more but not much more than that, so Ford needs to step it up here.
I'm not losing sleep yet. I been out of the auto game for a while, but I know well enough to not panic too much about a car that doesnt exist yet. Chevy says they want these cars with 400 hp to be priced at (or a liitle above) the GT. This is no easy feat. Hell, Ford pulled it off in no small way by keeping a solid axle in the car.
Chevy will be sharing the Camaro platform with a 4 door version. This will change the handling and feel of the 2 door, make no mistake of it (where as the Stang was designed from aft to stern as a stand alone 2 door platform from jump street)
you can shove a 700 hp engine in a station wagon, it doesnt make it a fun car to drive. There are still many more important charachteristics to a car than just the hp or torque of an engine.
so you gotta supercharge an engine to make power. yipty do!!!! with the possible new Cafe standards looming over the muscle car's heads, who do you think has a better chance of surviving. the big displacement pushrods from Chevy, or Ford's ability to get damn good power out of less displacement, with a rock solid aftermarket support.
I'm a Chevy guy more than a Ford guy believe it or not, but I bought a Mustang for a reason I aint losing a bit of sleep over it. IF a Chevy guy is busting your balls, look him in the eye and say "dude, you cant show off a car that doesnt exist yet"!
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07 Black GT, Red Interior. Manual Boomtubes, 3.73 gears, Saleen Suspension, Saleen Watts Link, JDM/Saleen CAI, 89 Octane tune Answers to the name "Rachel" :-)
GM has also stated that the Camaro will Cost the same as the Mustang, maybe 1500 more but not much more than that,
as I said in the post above, I'll believe this when I see it.
heck, the GT 500 is supossed to sell for 40 - 45g's, go to a Ford dealer with 45g cash and watch them laugh at you.
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07 Black GT, Red Interior. Manual Boomtubes, 3.73 gears, Saleen Suspension, Saleen Watts Link, JDM/Saleen CAI, 89 Octane tune Answers to the name "Rachel" :-)
Its funny how all you dog GM's engines saying they are dinosauric and won't survive the cafe requirements. All your ideas are based on the mustang having an sohc engine, and there so much more technically advanced, B/S. The camaro will have DOD (displacement on demand). GM already has a DOD engine they have been using for 3 years, 05 grand prix gxp ls4. Also the 08 cts already has direct-injection, wheres fords DI? I personally don't know the percentage of v8 to v6 mustangs sales. But if I were you guys I would really be scared of CAFE. The more the popular mustangs sell v8s the more that pulls fords CAFE down, so the very popularity of the mustang could make ford put a supercharged v6 gt.
Its funny how all you dog GM's engines saying they are dinosauric and won't survive the cafe requirements. All your ideas are based on the mustang having an sohc engine, and there so much more technically advanced, B/S. The camaro will have DOD (displacement on demand). GM already has a DOD engine they have been using for 3 years, 05 grand prix gxp ls4. Also the 08 cts already has direct-injection, wheres fords DI? I personally don't know the percentage of v8 to v6 mustangs sales. But if I were you guys I would really be scared of CAFE. The more the popular mustangs sell v8s the more that pulls fords CAFE down, so the very popularity of the mustang could make ford put a supercharged v6 gt.
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GM fanboy, please go away. Its funny however, how you quote engines that will most likely not go in the cars that we are talking about (even if it is the one from the G8 because DOD will do jack **** if the car weighs 500lb's more). Once again, this is all speculation but all of Chevy's "high performance" engines don't utilize the very things you are talking about... look at the vette (ls3, ls7, ls9) DOD? no. Hmm.... guess I named all of chevy's V8 "performance" engines for last years model run. Who cares if the next L"who gives a crap" engine has DOD, it will still be lower than ford because they have almost 2L more than the other competitors engines. The only thing im looking forward too is GM's supposedly 4.9L (350hp, lol) c7 vette engine. Now go tattle to your GM forums...
Furthermore, if you don't know the ratio of v6 to v8 sales, then you sure are not the one to comment on what you think we should be afraid of. Its like the bratty twelve year old telling the parent what to do. Ford has been dominating the pony car game since its inception. This time, ford will put the nail in the coffin, so make sure you get a new camaro...you probably won't be getting another one.
< Message edited by kyle2k -- 1/31/2008 12:46:29 PM >
GM has also stated that the Camaro will Cost the same as the Mustang, maybe 1500 more but not much more than that,
as I said in the post above, I'll believe this when I see it.
heck, the GT 500 is supossed to sell for 40 - 45g's, go to a Ford dealer with 45g cash and watch them laugh at you.
Theres one problem with what you just said....
The Camaro ISNT going to be a limited production car. So belive what you want but the camaro is going to be the best bargain car.
There's one problem with what you just said...
The GT500 really isn't either. It is basically the SVT....OH, and the fact that the camaro isn't going to be 500hp too...
You like to be a Ford fan boy dont you.... The GT500 isa limited production car. The production numbers for the GT500 for 2007 is 10,000 units. The truth is the Camaro is going to be priced right with the current stang models. So youll be looking ata 400hp+ car for around 29k.
Posts: 1087
Joined: 11/28/2005 From: Northern VA Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: kyle2k
quote:
ORIGINAL: SoSmoked
Its funny how all you dog GM's engines saying they are dinosauric and won't survive the cafe requirements. All your ideas are based on the mustang having an sohc engine, and there so much more technically advanced, B/S. The camaro will have DOD (displacement on demand). GM already has a DOD engine they have been using for 3 years, 05 grand prix gxp ls4. Also the 08 cts already has direct-injection, wheres fords DI? I personally don't know the percentage of v8 to v6 mustangs sales. But if I were you guys I would really be scared of CAFE. The more the popular mustangs sell v8s the more that pulls fords CAFE down, so the very popularity of the mustang could make ford put a supercharged v6 gt.
'
GM fanboy, please go away. Its funny however, how you quote engines that will most likely not go in the cars that we are talking about (even if it is the one from the G8 because DOD will do jack **** if the car weighs 500lb's more). Once again, this is all speculation but all of Chevy's "high performance" engines don't utilize the very things you are talking about... look at the vette (ls3, ls7, ls9) DOD? no. Hmm.... guess I named all of chevy's V8 "performance" engines for last years model run. Who cares if the next L"who gives a crap" engine has DOD, it will still be lower than ford because they have almost 2L more than the other competitors engines. The only thing im looking forward too is GM's supposedly 4.9L (350hp, lol) c7 vette engine. Now go tattle to your GM forums...
Furthermore, if you don't know the ratio of v6 to v8 sales, then you sure are not the one to comment on what you think we should be afraid of. Its like the bratty twelve year old telling the parent what to do. Ford has been dominating the pony car game since its inception. This time, ford will put the nail in the coffin, so make sure you get a new camaro...you probably won't be getting another one.
Actually the Camaro with the Zeta Frame is going to weight about 100 lbs more than our S197's The prototypes (not Concept) already are there.
GM changed the Name of the DOD to AFM (Active Fuel Managment) this will turn off the injectors and spark to cylinders at low power situations like highway cruising. They have already stated that the Camaro will exceed CAFE standards and will be closer to the 2020 standards with their next Gen IV and Gen V Engines. Take all you know about GM LS motors and throw it out the windows because the New one are going to be world class. So again Ford needs to setup and work on better fuel managment and maybe larger displacment engines that get 30mpg, GM is. Don't hate the GM products, they have always been one step ahead of Ford in HP, and they always will. One engine that is slated for the Camaro is the 3.8L DI 300hp V6 lets see Ford get that from their 3.8L or 4.0 N/A ain't going to happen.
When Hilary wins and gets into office she has already stated that one funding options for the National Health care is increasing the National Gas Tax and over 3 years to meet with current European prices, (Yes look forward to $7.00 per gal gas) Why do you think europe pays such high prices, Oil is a commodity that is traded world wide so what we pay per barrel they pay. How else does one pay for health care for all? you got to get the money from somewhere.
< Message edited by 2k05gt -- 1/31/2008 1:35:02 PM >
You like to be a Ford fan boy dont you.... The GT500 isa limited production car. The production numbers for the GT500 for 2007 is 10,000 units. The truth is the Camaro is going to be priced right with the current stang models. So youll be looking ata 400hp+ car for around 29k.
You should talk, why are you on a mustang forum anyway. To keep us in check? If the new Chevy engines are what they say they are thats great, but you need to realize the only reason they are up on ford in HP is because of the larger displacement. Period. I would like to see where you get the numbers for GM getting 30mpg, link me and I will get off the topic.
Furthermore, lets not bring in Hilary, she isn't going to win, let alone get the nomination. Lets keep the topic on cars for I am guilty of letting political crap get out of hand.
You like to be a Ford fan boy dont you.... The GT500 isa limited production car. The production numbers for the GT500 for 2007 is 10,000 units. The truth is the Camaro is going to be priced right with the current stang models. So youll be looking ata 400hp+ car for around 29k.
You should talk, why are you on a mustang forum anyway. To keep us in check? If the new Chevy engines are what they say they are thats great, but you need to realize the only reason they are up on ford in HP is because of the larger displacement. Period. I would like to see where you get the numbers for GM getting 30mpg, link me and I will get off the topic.
Furthermore, lets not bring in Hilary, she isn't going to win, let alone get the nomination. Lets keep the topic on cars for I am guilty of letting political crap get out of hand.
Larger displacement isnt really true the north star V8 witch isa 4.6 put out 300hp in 1996....the new 05 Mustangs are just now reaching that mark.
Im here because I enjoy the people. I cant help your not educated in Chevy's.
The LS7 Vette gets about 30MPG highway.... The 5.3L impala gets 28MPG highway.
The northstar isnt an engine that chevy uses in any true performance models. Also, CAFE and I am refering to average. Not highway. I would love to be wrong for I actually like the looks of the new camaro, but I'm looking for the more technical performance engine this time around... Not another pushrod...I wonder if they'll actually develop a new engine for this car or use the same parts bin like most of their other cross platform cars.
The northstar isnt an engine that chevy uses in any true performance models. Also, CAFE and I am refering to average. Not highway. I would love to be wrong for I actually like the looks of the new camaro, but I'm looking for the more technical performance engine this time around... Not another pushrod...I wonder if they'll actually develop a new engine for this car or use the same parts bin like most of their other cross platform cars.
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RE: New engine line up for 2009 Mustang - 
