Question for Red Davil on 99-04 JDM Kit.

04#231SC · 11-15-2007, 08:32 AM

Hey Red, I see where you had some work done to your 04 this past year and you are now putting down 375hp I think I saw in your signature. You said you had JDM do the tune etc. It looks like I have most of the mods you had (look in my signature) I think except fuel injectors. Yet with a some what mild SCT tune I came in at 338 hp and 358 torque. I plan to get a better tune in the spring but I wanted to know what else I may have missed here compared to what you have. I would love to have JDM tune my 04 but I am in NHand well he is just a wee bit too far away. Plus the car is pretty much put away for the winter at this point.

Also what are your thoughts on the Chicane Intercooler that sits below the Supercharger. It looks like a great piece and would seem to make sense as it would keep thecharger running cooler. Any thoughts on that? Did you do that mod? Performance Autosport did a great test on it and Mark looks to have picked up at least 32 hp with it? I know I need to get a smaller belt and maybe an Idler system to tighten things up. But over all you are still almost 40 hp greater then what I got.

Thanks and I appreciate your feedback on this forum.

Peace

Red_Devil · 11-15-2007, 09:17 AM

Probably the biggest differances are that I skipped out on the chicane pulley and used the 05+ Extreme pulley instead, its smaller, and alot lighter. I felt that big steel pulley was too much rotational mass. The injectors are also huge because your gonna be able to handle higher boost levels with an upraded fueling system.

Aside from that, I just really cant speak higher of Jim and his tunes. He can probably take any set up and squeeze more HP out of it then what you currently have.

As far as the Chicane intercooler goes there is some misconceptions I have heard about it. The horsepower gain was compared to the old intercooler used in the series 2 and possibly some of the early series 4 units that had holes so big you could drop keys through it. The new intercooler is much more efficient and actually looks very similer to the chicane one with the exception of the flange around the outside. Our flange has some areas on the corner where hot air pockets may be able to squeeze through, and the chicane intercooler does not, which deffinetly makes it an upgrade. However, for the cost, I personally would probably reccomend an upgraded heat exchanger first as it would yeild far better results.

04#231SC · 11-15-2007, 12:58 PM

Thank you Jared for the feedback. How much is the 05 Pulley and did you go with a smaller belt or a idler system to tighten up your belt form slipping? What Heat Exchanger would you reccomend? Also what is the JDM Air kit? Is that the same as the JLT CAI?

Jon

Say When · 11-15-2007, 09:09 PM

Quote:

ORIGINAL: Red_Devil

Probably the biggest differances are that I skipped out on the chicane pulley and used the 05+ Extreme pulley instead, its smaller, and alot lighter. I felt that big steel pulley was too much rotational mass. The injectors are also huge because your gonna be able to handle higher boost levels with an upraded fueling system.

Aside from that, I just really cant speak higher of Jim and his tunes. He can probably take any set up and squeeze more HP out of it then what you currently have.

As far as the Chicane intercooler goes there is some misconceptions I have heard about it. The horsepower gain was compared to the old intercooler used in the series 2 and possibly some of the early series 4 units that had holes so big you could drop keys through it. The new intercooler is much more efficient and actually looks very similer to the chicane one with the exception of the flange around the outside. Our flange has some areas on the corner where hot air pockets may be able to squeeze through, and the chicane intercooler does not, which deffinetly makes it an upgrade. However, for the cost, I personally would probably reccomend an upgraded heat exchanger first as it would yeild far better results.

Bro, Genius,

Man, what good is a better heat exchanger going to yield if there is no heat in the water system to begin with? ( did you ever notice the gauge barely moves on a stock supercharged Saleen? ) The needle does not move because Saleen's heat exchanger does not extractmuch heat. The hot air goes around the perimeter and through those big "key holes" you talked about.

What the hell were you guy's thinking when you designed that unit?

If the engineers didn't know what they were doing when they designedit, what leads me to believe you know what you are talking about.

Here's how it works. The by product of compressed air is heat. Hot air bad, cold air good. The entire function of the intercooler is to grab the hot supercharged air and remove the heat from it. Since this is an Air to Water intercooler, the water's function is to remove the heat from the supercharged air. Water goes into the intercooler cold.... and comes out hot. But in Saleen's case becuase of inefficiency it comes out luke warm. By inefficiency, I mean the gaps around the perimeter that you could shove a cd through and the key holes you talked about you can shove about 18 #2 pencils through that thing.I've owned one. THATs why the needle does not move much and you guys don't think the gauge is working. The thing does not see any activity.

What good is a better heat exchanger going to do for you when all the heat ran around the damn thing. Air is lazy, it takes the path of least resistence.

That Chicane intercooler you were talking about would have trapped all of the heat, and you would have gained a lot more power. Lower intake temperatures mean denser air charge, ie: more air molecules in the same space.

You probably just couldn't afford the thinganyway.

Tas · 11-15-2007, 10:03 PM

I thought i read that spearco was going to do the intercooler on the series 4 but there was a disagreement over something to do with the s7

C.Saleen · 11-15-2007, 11:51 PM

Joe Intercooler is BY Far The best Bang for your buck mod on any 99-04 Saleen supercharged car.
What Joe has done on numerous products is GREATLY improve upon Saleen's design. The worst thing Saleen did was let him walk out that door, Chicane makes some of the best products in the industy, all of them have extensive design and functionality to them. This is all coming from an East Coast guy. If it wasent for Joe Saleen wouldnt be where it is today the man is smater than most when it comes to mustangs. His Intercooler does what the Saleen one lacks, COOL AIR remove the heat, all a heat exchange is going to do is cool the fluid, what good is that when the air is still going into the engine hot, get the chicane intercooler and dont let the hot air in, LOWER YOUR IAT temps, which will allow you to run more Timing, More timing=TONS MORE HP, the key to power in any supercharged 4.6 is timing. The lower the IAT the more timing you can run the more power you can make, its simple math. YOu can add all the pulleys and tunes and other crap you want, but in the end IF THE AIR IS HOT and the computer reads HOT IAT temps it going to Pull timing no mater if you JDM enginering or any one else that FORD computer is going to pull timing when the IAT temps go up, nothing you do to the comptuer can change that. So to avoid this cool the air going in lower the IAT's and make more power by adding more timing. its simple math.

eviligloo · 11-16-2007, 07:58 AM

Quote:

ORIGINAL: C.Saleen

Joe Intercooler is BY Far The best Bang for your buck mod on any 99-04 Saleen supercharged car.
What Joe has done on numerous products is GREATLY improve upon Saleen's design. The worst thing Saleen did was let him walk out that door, Chicane makes some of the best products in the industy, all of them have extensive design and functionality to them. This is all coming from an East Coast guy. If it wasent for Joe Saleen wouldnt be where it is today the man is smater than most when it comes to mustangs. His Intercooler does what the Saleen one lacks, COOL AIR remove the heat, all a heat exchange is going to do is cool the fluid, what good is that when the air is still going into the engine hot, get the chicane intercooler and dont let the hot air in, LOWER YOUR IAT temps, which will allow you to run more Timing, More timing=TONS MORE HP, the key to power in any supercharged 4.6 is timing. The lower the IAT the more timing you can run the more power you can make, its simple math. YOu can add all the pulleys and tunes and other crap you want, but in the end IF THE AIR IS HOT and the computer reads HOT IAT temps it going to Pull timing no mater if you JDM enginering or any one else that FORD computer is going to pull timing when the IAT temps go up, nothing you do to the comptuer can change that. So to avoid this cool the air going in lower the IAT's and make more power by adding more timing. its simple math.

Haha...that's a goodmarketing pitchfor the Chicane Intercooler. Makes methink about thatover brake upgrades.

Then again...do I really need more power?

What was your gain from the intercooler, C.Saleen? about 30rwhp or so?

04#231SC · 11-16-2007, 07:58 AM

Wow, this is a good healthy debate now. I see all points that Say When and C. Saleen have put out here. I will look at that as my next Mod in the spring and with a better tune afterwards. I just wish I could get the Intercooler for less then $800.00 then figure a couple of hunderd to install. There goes my tax refeund.

Thanks for the feedback guy. Hey Say When if you don't mind me asking , did you work for Saleen or were involved with them in some way?. You really know your stuff about there cars
C Saleen I met you this summer at the Fun Ford Weekend in Epping I had the 04 Vert that parked next to you. Again thanks alot.

eviligloo · 11-16-2007, 08:07 AM

Quote:

ORIGINAL: 04#231SC
Hey Say When if you don't mind me asking , did you work for Saleen or were involved with them in some way?. You really know your stuff about there cars

I've been wondering this myself. Don't remember if you answered it before or not....

Say When · 11-16-2007, 10:10 AM

I have never worked at Saleen.

I can find my ass with two hands.

"But I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night."