we received the first batch of heads and they look pretty nice compared to the stock E7's. For the money, these will be a solid choice for those searching for some serious power gains on the cheap. Here's some pics as we tore down one of our mechanics 84 GT for the swap. We'll have them installed and running late tonight so dyno results will be tomorrow if we're lucky.
Anyway, for now you can see the dramatic difference in the chambers, bowls, valve sizes, and port comparisons. Sorry for the rough pics, but we didn't want to wait to get these tested and let you know what to expect from them. For the 1st 6 sets we have left we're running an intro deal at $850 shipped. These come assembled complete, ready to bolt on and sprung up to a .550 lift hyd roller cam.
Here's what you'll need for the swap:
Heads $850
Rockers (3/8 stud mount) $229
Head Gaskets (Felpro 1011-2) $70/pr
Intake Gaskets (Felpro 1250) $25/pr
Exhaust Gaskets (Felpro 1415) $20/pr
Hardened Pushrods (may change from stock pending your cam) $86/set
Valve Cover Gaskets (rubber or cork) $15/pr
ARP Head Bolt Kit (ARP-154-3601 ) $40/set
Total: $1335 in parts Labor if you have someone or a shop swap would most likely run between $250-$600. Not bad for a serious bump in HP/TQ as well as an extra 50-75lbs off the nose of your steed.
Here are some other recommended parts to add to the build if you're looking for even more power and performance:
Intake Manifold (EFI) $350-$550
Hyd Roller Cam $150-$190
New Roller Lifters $110/set
New Dbl Roller Timing Set $40-$75
Front Cover Gaskets $25
65mm-75mm TB & EGR $200-$325
Cold Air Kit $140-$190
Rear Gear Upgrade (3.55-4.30) $150-$225
Headers (Long Tube or Short) $125-$300
Mid Pipe to go with Headers $130-$185
That should give you guys a ton of options on getting the most out of a tired fox. If you don't think the engine is up to spec or just has too many miles then we also have shortblocks or longbocks available from $1599 (306 - balanced and blueprinted with Forged Probe Pistons, Prepped Rods, Prepped Crank, New block 0.30 over, including ARP main & rod bolts and performance rings & bearings, assembled and ready to add the above parts to.)
Check out the pics and let us know what you think...results coming soon.
Compare the Stock E7's to the new Patriot Freedom 185 cc Alum Head with 2.02 & 1.6 Valves 60cc chambers:
850 is a rediculously good deal. i wishi could pick up a set right now
TTGreenSN95
10-27-2007, 01:52 AM
Those heads look ported to me are they ported or right out of the box?
Just wanted to know so we dont expect the same dyno numbers from an unported set?
I did not see in your post were you mention that these heads are ported?
see image.........
stang8689
10-27-2007, 08:45 AM
They just tested those in 5.0 mag. They got 298 rwhp with Cobra intake and bolt ons
bikeboy587
10-27-2007, 09:50 AM
if i had the money i would be placing an order right now!
texashotrods
10-27-2007, 10:03 AM
ORIGINAL: TTGreenSN95
Those heads look ported to me are they ported or right out of the box?
Just wanted to know so we dont expect the same dyno numbers from an unported set?
I did not see in your post were you mention that these heads are ported?
see image.........
These are straight out of the box. They come as-cast but then Patriot does a port match on the intake, exhaust, and cleans up the bowls a bit. They also port in around the base of the valve guide to un-shroud it as well. These are just a few rough pics from last night as they came out of the box next to the old E7's right off the motor in the pics.
Texas5.0
10-27-2007, 10:22 AM
Those are the heads that I have. Just got them put on last week. I am interested to see what cam you guys pick since I have not done that yet - I ran out of money. Post some numbers - I would like to see what I am near.
thesource
10-27-2007, 11:06 AM
These heads are the ProComp castings . They are a replica of the Vic Jr head and are from Austrilia but casted in China . I have a set of some of the very first ones done . They are 220 cc CNC'd heads with a 2.05/1.60 valve . The CNC work was done through Avenger Cylinder heads , the same guys that did some of the Canfield stuff . I have them on a 393W and they are pretty decent for the price I paid for them .
thesource
10-27-2007, 11:07 AM
And those cast iron ford heads look ported to me , the exhaust looks alot bigger than stock .
BEAVERSCUSTOMS
10-27-2007, 12:16 PM
auctlly they mad 302 hp and 344 tq.
ORIGINAL: stang8689
They just tested those in 5.0 mag. They got 298 rwhp with Cobra intake and bolt ons
ctgreddy
10-27-2007, 12:50 PM
how would these heads compare to the canfields 195's?
im lookin for some heads and right now an set on the canfields but the price of those patriots is so irresistable.
Texas5.0
10-27-2007, 01:24 PM
Today is the first day that I have really gotten on the car since I had the heads installed. I gave it about 500 miles for break in since I had a piston replaced also. I am very impressed with the power increase. There is a significant power increase from 2500 rpm's and up. My low end power seems to be a little better also but once the car hits 2500 its WAY better than what it was before. I took a risk getting these heads and so far I am very happy with them.
FLcracker9
10-28-2007, 07:25 PM
ORIGINAL: Texas5.0
Today is the first day that I have really gotten on the car since I had the heads installed. I gave it about 500 miles for break in since I had a piston replaced also. I am very impressed with the power increase. There is a significant power increase from 2500 rpm's and up. My low end power seems to be a little better also but once the car hits 2500 its WAY better than what it was before. I took a risk getting these heads and so far I am very happy with them.
Are you using them with stock pistons?, is your cam stock?
my77stang
10-28-2007, 08:03 PM
i'd just like to point out the fact that i found these first:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D
but seriously, i have a 289 block prepped on the stand waiting for assembly - accepting donations from the OP ;)
Texas5.0
10-28-2007, 08:20 PM
Stock cam and stock pistons.
1SLO85
10-29-2007, 08:33 PM
Excellent info Brian. I will get a 5.0 Mod to make it a sticky. :)
stang8689
10-29-2007, 08:41 PM
yeah i saw it made 302, didn't read it enough. They used Dteeda #18 cam
Texas5.0
10-29-2007, 09:35 PM
Yep... here is the thread that I started about that..
ok, got some updates. Heads are on and we have 3 more sets in stock. We have 3 variations now available after working with Gunnar at Patriot to set up so THR Specials.
Bare Set - Castings only 185cc, 60 cc combustion chamber, no valves, springs, etc $499/pair $25 freight for Forum Members
Assembled Complete - 185cc, 60 cc chambers, .550 lift springs, $850 Shipped ** Limited Time offer for Forum Members**
Assembled Upgrade Complete - 185 cc, 60 cc chambers, .650 lift springs, $1075 shipped. Forum Members Special
We are going to try to dyno the shop car tonight so stay tuned for results before and after.
Texas5.0
11-01-2007, 06:12 PM
The suspense for numbers is killing me.... Post Them!!!
kaik1969
11-02-2007, 10:18 AM
Whats the result? I can't wait.
Texas_Hot_Rods
11-02-2007, 12:32 PM
OK, here are the dyno numbers from last night with the new heads installed and properly broken in and rockers set.
First, Here's the Build Specs:
84 GT
THR 306 ARP Rod & Main Bolts, Balanced with Forged Pistons $1599
B303 Cam $165
ProForm 1.7 3/8 stud rockers $175
MAC LT Headers $237
MAC Pro Chamber $256
MAC Dumps $229
Felpro Gaskets $110 (Complete Motor set)
4.10 Gears $189
Edelbrock Air Gap Dual Plane intake $249
Holley 4BBL Carb 650 CFM $340
Basics:
T-5 Transmission with 8.8 swap Rear End, Before numbers are with stock E-7 Heads, After numbers with the Patriot 185 Alum Heads.
BEFORE Dyno Results after tuning, jetting, timing, fuel pressure adjustments to maximize performance.
274.9 RWHP @ 5118 RPM
302.4 RWTQ @ 4323 RPM
AFTER Dyno Results after tuning, jetting, timing, fuel pressure adjustements to maximize performance.
338.7 RWHP @ 5659 RPM
343.7 RWTQ @ 4319 RPM
NET GAIN:
+ 63.8 RWHP Peak
+ 41.3 RWTQ Peak
+ 30 RWHP Average Gain (2500-5800 RPM)
+41 RWTQ Average Gain (2500-5800 RPM)
This is a serious gain in both HP & Torque that shows not only in the dyno results but in real world seat of the pants! Let us know if you have any other questions on this project. We'll have nitrous numbers once we get a built 8.8 under the car (stock axles right now), and some track times in the near future. If anyone is interested in a specific build up for testing, let us know and we'll try to make it happen so you can see real world results from THR.
Here are the graphs to show the difference in performance with the new heads installed and tuned.
*** All Numbers from our In Ground Mustang Dynometer 4th gear pulls with Load for accurate A/F and performance calibration. ***
Stroked91
11-02-2007, 02:44 PM
how much better can these heads flow over ported gt40s iron
Texas_Hot_Rods
11-02-2007, 03:23 PM
No comparison, you'll still pick up power and with the alum they'll shed weight and dissapate heat more quickly allowing a more aggressive timing curve. The GT-40's area nice head but can't compare to a 185 cc runner with 2.02 valves. I had a set of Extrude Hone Ported/Polished GT'40 irons on one of my stangs that had bigger 1.84 & 1.54 valves installed and they still fell 50 HP short of an AFR 185 on a mild cammed 302. Hope this helps!
Stroked91
11-02-2007, 03:45 PM
i saw the price of your heads and was thinkin what route i wanna go cause i was about to drop 500 to port my gt40s out
Texas5.0
11-02-2007, 03:46 PM
Iam not familiar with carbed applications at all but the numbers seem good to me?
Any plans for EFI tests?
Stroked91
11-02-2007, 04:00 PM
yea def some efi numbers would be nice cause im lookin to get my heads by the end of the month
Texas_Hot_Rods
11-04-2007, 08:39 AM
You'd be much better selling the GT40's as they can bring as much as $500 if in good shape, take the other $500 you wanted to spend and get a set of alum heads, and put the rest towards the other items you'll need like gaskets, ARP Head Bolts if you don't have them, dbl roller timing chain, rockers, etc. You'll make alot more power and save weight as well. If you don't have a cam, you can roll that into the picture as well and pick up even more with more RPM on tap.
Texas_Hot_Rods
11-04-2007, 08:45 AM
ORIGINAL: Texas5.0
Iam not familiar with carbed applications at all but the numbers seem good to me?
Any plans for EFI tests?
We had originally planned on an EFI test but got to pulling the motor as the baseline showed oil pressure dropping pretty hard on the dyno. Now we're going to throw in a carbed 357 inch alum headed monster and a C4 to make it another THR street beast.
*** If any one wants to do an article on a mild combo EFI car I'll work out a sponsored package deal with some goodies. It would have to be dyno'd before and after at the same place for accurate numbers. Let me know if any of you guys/gals are interested. Thanks! ***
P.S. Carbs will almost always make more power if jetted correctly. EFI is great, but the carb is the power king when it comes to the race track.
Texas_Hot_Rods
11-04-2007, 08:51 AM
ORIGINAL: Stroked91
yea def some efi numbers would be nice cause im lookin to get my heads by the end of the month
What are you running for combo right now?
EFI to carb would be within 10-15 hp in most cases as long as the tune is the same and the EFI induction is not limiting airflow (ie. stock EFImanifold vs carbed single plane or hi rise dual plane) If the combination is set up correctly, the carb will most likely gain some power, especially up top, but you'd still be in the same ballpark for the EFI numbers.
One more thing to note is that you've got to check PTV (piston to valve) clearance on all applications. If you guys/gals would want us to post an article on the proper way to check for clearances when doing a cam/head swap let us know and we'll post up some more pics.
Stroked91
11-04-2007, 12:25 PM
lookin at a cobra intake - e303 cam - 1.72 rockers - maybe a 70mm throttle body. im only looking at tryin to get a 300hp daily driver. just something to have some fun in. i was gonna use the gt40s but then i saw the post about the heads you have so i figured i would take a look and see
Texas_Hot_Rods
11-05-2007, 12:38 PM
Do you already have the parts you posted or do you need them? The alum head would make hitting the 300 rwhp mark much easier. I ran a set of Iron GT-40's on my stock 302 that had been Extrude Hone ported and polished with bigger valves, and E cam, 1.6 rockers, cobra intake that was also Extrude Hone ported, long tubes, O/R H, dumps, 75 TB & C7L 76 MAF with 24's and a custom cold air kit. With more than 20 pulls on a dyno to tune it on a 0 deg day at Anderson Ford, we barely netted 298.6 rwhp.
He, Rick Anderson, was amazed as my buddy with a TFS headed GT40 intake and the same mods only made 287.6 RWHP with a custom tune from Rick's PMS system through his AODE. So if you're looking for 300 rwhp with the GT-40's, it most likely won't be easy. With the alum heads and the same combo with a 5 speed, 300 RWHP should be pretty achievable.
Stroked91
11-05-2007, 12:58 PM
i have the intake rockers and heads headers and maf already thats all but i mena i can always sell the stuff if i go that route. so i can pretty much hit my mark wit these heads a lot easier
Texas_Hot_Rods
11-06-2007, 10:24 AM
If you already have the rockers they are most likely for teh pedastal mount GT40 heads which won't work on the new alum ones. You'd be better off putting them up for grabs along with the GT40 heads and rolling the cash into the new alum pieces. If you want to trade them towards the alum ones and some new rockers, I'll take em as long as they're in good shape. (ie. no bent valves, not rusted, not milled too deep). Let me know, we'd love to get you out there making more power!
Stroked91
11-06-2007, 11:20 AM
i sent you a pm
XPBaller
11-08-2007, 09:38 PM
How do these patriots compare to Canfields and AFRs?
89TripleWhite
11-11-2007, 01:38 AM
what kind of long blocks do you have? PM me
Texas_Hot_Rods
11-12-2007, 02:26 PM
ORIGINAL: XPBaller
How do these patriots compare to Canfields and AFRs?
They are not of the same quality as far as components and materials as the AFR's are CNC ported and the Canfields are much larger 195 cc on the runners. These are a budget head for those looking to make big power gains for modest motors. These are not a fully prepped race head like the Canfiields or the AFR's but they are also several hundred less in cost so you can't complain. If you have $1400-$1500 for a set of heads, order a better head, but for $850 shipped, you can't go wrong.
Jasperstang308
11-12-2007, 02:30 PM
it does sound like the better deal for those are wanting to buy gt40 heads and then pay to have extensive work done to them. so in the matter this does sound like a better deal for the buck
XPBaller
11-13-2007, 10:05 PM
very nice.
jus4fun
12-21-2007, 07:45 PM
I am installing these heads on a 1979 302 plus.030. comp cam 292/560 roller rockers. trw forged 2488 pistons victor junior intake, 750 holly msd ign and dist.4:30 gears a c4 with 9 inch converter and brake. The car is an 87 that used to be a 4 cyl.2 questions, I have a set of diamond racing pushrods from my old heads 6.875 .080 will these work? I am going to pick up a checker. The valves are .100 longer then stock. #2 I have a compucar bottle set up 50 - 275 hp. What do I do with my timeing. I'll start with the 100 hp jets. any help would be great Never messed with a bottle before. I am running a Barry Grant electric pump and regulator
G Racer
01-15-2008, 10:50 AM
If any one would like to take those heads to the next level please contact me. It is the best investment you can make. The heads are where the power is!
www.steadfastperformance.com (http://www.steadfastperformance.com)
roostracing
01-23-2008, 08:56 PM
and what is it that you do...port them out? How much labor wise?
302army187
01-23-2008, 10:42 PM
ok, well i have a question for you mr texas hot rod's.......
im wanting to do this when i rebuild my engine, so what heads/rods would you recomend?
i havent decided if im going to bore /030 over or not, but id like to make a RELIABLE street car pushing 350hp and 350ft lb's to the wheels....
what would YOU recommend?
G Racer
01-24-2008, 08:35 AM
A very good Bracket Race type Port: REshape guides, bowls, Intake gasket match, polish exhaust portis going to cost $550 for the pair.
Bad Karma
01-26-2008, 01:22 AM
ORIGINAL: 302army187
ok, well i have a question for you mr texas hot rod's.......
im wanting to do this when i rebuild my engine, so what heads/rods would you recomend?
i havent decided if im going to bore /030 over or not, but id like to make a RELIABLE street car pushing 350hp and 350ft lb's to the wheels....
what would YOU recommend?
If that ain't throwin a hot dog down a school hallway, I don't know what is....
-Ivan
StangfreakGTS
03-05-2008, 10:51 AM
will the 2.02 intake valves work on a stock 1995 short block or would i need aftermarket pistons? if they will clear the factory pistons what would the cam lift be limeted to?
ttop83stang
03-11-2008, 11:31 PM
Are these heads still available at this price?
chath_brick
03-12-2008, 01:36 PM
ORIGINAL: StangfreakGTS
will the 2.02 intake valves work on a stock 1995 short block or would i need aftermarket pistons? if they will clear the factory pistons what would the cam lift be limeted to?
i was also wondering this
Rajun_Cajun
03-14-2008, 12:45 AM
Yall will have to check the PTV clearance yourselves, or whomever is doing the cam swap. He can give you an estimate, but its almost always different with every motor.
tango1846
03-25-2008, 11:21 PM
I have a 65mm t/b,75mm maf,1.7rr,cold air induction,headers(not sure what make,bought it already on),h-pipe,2 chamber flow masters,373 gears on a 95GT. What would be the approx. hp gain with these heads. Does patriot have 165cc heads or would 185cc be better? Would this be a good idea to do a head swap with 118,000 miles on the motor?
Thanks
Scott
tango1846
03-26-2008, 08:40 PM
I have a 65mm t/b,75mm maf,1.7rr,cold air induction,headers(not sure what make,bought it already on),h-pipe,2 chamber flow masters,373 gears on a 95GT. What would be the approx. hp gain with these heads. Does patriot have 165cc heads or would 185cc be better? Would this be a good idea to do a head swap with 118,000 miles on the motor?
Thanks
Scott
Texas_Hot_Rods
03-31-2008, 12:19 AM
First off there's alot of different ways to get to that power level pretty easy. We built a few 306's that will nearly hit that but it's safe to say a 347 would be a better street car for the 350-360 RWHP mark. You can get close with a 306 but i'll be a nasty, rowdy, hi compression, hi rpm set up to reach you goal all motor.
OR
You can build a mild 10:1 347 with the same induction (Alum H/C/I) and you'll be there all day long with a more streetable set up. Cost aside, the 347 will also be a solid daily driver. We've done several with mild TFS Top Eng Kits that all made 340-370 rwhp with a set of headers and good tune.
We have a motor sale about to begin for next months promo. Call or PM us for more details!
Brian (915) 449-6224.
P.S. If you want to run these heads you'll need aftermarket pistons that have valve reliefs (FlyCuts) that will clear the 2.02 intake valves or you need to run a small cam like Steeda #18. With the smaller cam you'll still make good power and sound nice.
Texas_Hot_Rods
03-31-2008, 12:24 AM
ORIGINAL: tango1846
I have a 65mm t/b,75mm maf,1.7rr,cold air induction,headers(not sure what make,bought it already on),h-pipe,2 chamber flow masters,373 gears on a 95GT. What would be the approx. hp gain with these heads. Does patriot have 165cc heads or would 185cc be better? Would this be a good idea to do a head swap with 118,000 miles on the motor?
Thanks
Scott
Thanks for the question Scott. The Patriots only come in a 185 config and they won't clear a stock shortblock unless you're carefull on the cam selection. Stick with a smaller grind like the Steeda #18 and you should be fine but ALWAYS check PTV! The original motor with 118k should be fine as long as it's running OK to start. You can also check compression to ensure it's still tight. Let us know if you need to know how to check it. Thanks!
tango1846
04-02-2008, 10:18 PM
Thanks Brian.By the way, what should the compression be? Also what do you think about the steeda #19 cam?
Scott
302army187
04-02-2008, 10:53 PM
well mr texas hotrod.........
wouldent the 347 be more likely to warp, or crack a block with the cylender walls so thin?
i like the idea of a 347 with a 150 shot, but im afraid that its to much spray for such a bored out block!
what are your thoughts on this?
tango1846
04-03-2008, 06:38 AM
Brian,
I have another question about a misfire every once in a while. I put new plugs in along with wires, cap and rotor. A machanic tried to put it on a scanner & it wouldn'tscan on his system. Do you have any ideas what it might be?
Thanks again
Scott
peter77
04-23-2008, 06:57 PM
is this a limited quantity? I may have my next add on. Thanks
BlessedHellride
05-26-2008, 04:15 PM
[quote]ORIGINAL: 302army187
well mr texas hotrod.........
wouldent the 347 be more likely to warp, or crack a block with the cylender walls so thin?
i like the idea of a 347 with a 150 shot, but im afraid that its to much spray for such a bored out block!
what are your thoughts on this?
The cylinder walls of the block on 99.9% of all 347cid, specially in a stock block, are only .030" overbore. Where do you get your information of cylinder walls warping and or cracking the block. It's no secret what causes stock blocks to fail. A properly built 347 will handle a 150 shot on a block that's no more bored out than a 306cid engine.
302army187
06-07-2008, 03:30 PM
ORIGINAL: 302army187
ok, well i have a question for you mr texas hot rod's.......
im wanting to do this when i rebuild my engine, so what heads/rods would you recomend?
i havent decided if im going to bore /030 over or not, but id like to make a RELIABLE street car pushing 350hp and 350ft lb's to the wheels....
what would YOU recommend?
just for an update, this post i made was 12 days after i got my car, first 5.0, or v8 for that matter ive ever owned.
i know alot more about these lil' cars now-a-days.
my question is what is the current price for these heads, and what valve covers clear them
lxman1
07-26-2008, 08:36 PM
$935 according to the website http://www.texashotrods.com/storefrontprofiles/DeluxeSFItemDetail.aspx?sid=1&sfid=70952&c=0&i=237 074284
bigap15
09-09-2008, 09:51 AM
I got a set of these patriot heads at a machine shop as we speak. There are many many problems with these heads. The exhaust flange is rough and will not seal a gasket, has to be machined better. The intake ports were a 1/4 inch low meaning it wont line up with the intake, had to epoxy the floor of the port and take out some of the top to make them line up. The valve job is ****ty, it needed alot of work. They are sposed to be 58cc combustion chamber which they wasnt, they were more like 60. Im going to have about 1400 in this set of heads and couldve just bought afrs. After the work is done im going to have them flowed to get a comparison. Stay away from these heads.
XPBaller
09-16-2008, 12:39 PM
I took mine to a head shop as well. Different story though, they said they were great for the price. Sorry about your experience dude.