I don't understand why the carbon patch directly on top of the gold contacts is any more or less reponsive ... what difference does it make? Although this mod may work ... perhaps the reason why is not 100% correct?
Could be different thicknesses allowing more or less current to flow. Riostat?
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I'm in agreement with you DMHINES. Where the pad contacts probably isn't the deciding factor here. I think the logic may be a little wrong. In giving it some thought, I have a different theory which relies on the ECU recalibrating. If you assuming that the ECU takes the initial resistance value as a zero point, a decrease in resistance results in an increase in acceleration. For simplicity lets say the ECU reads 25 ohms at the zero point. And let's say its programmed to divide this up into 25 "speed" selections (we know it's infinite, but this is for illustration). For every 1 ohm you decrease, you increase in speed by one selection. Now, let's say you move the pad placement further down. Now you're starting at say... 20 ohms instead of 25. Now, again the ECU divides it into 25 "speed selections" and we have 0.8 ohms decrease equals an increase of one speed selection. This means it takes less movement of the gas pedal to get the same increase in speed. You haven't removed the dead spot per say, you've increased the sensitivity of the pedal.
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2006 Premium V6 Vista Blue Mustang, Pony Package, AVIC-Z1, Shaker 500 speakers, Light Graphite Leather Seats, Flowmaster American Thunder Exhaust, Steeda CAI, Brenspeed 93 Tune
I think people are getting confused..... They're thinking 'throttle response'. That is wrong. That is something that can be improved with a computer tune.
What the original posted is talking about is actual physical dead space. Not a computer thing, but actual dead space. The brushes don't touch anything with the pedal not pressed. When it is pressed then it takes half an inch of pressure to cut through this physical dead space to even reach the contacts in the first place. That is what the original poster is trying to fix.
Ohnosaez, I'm in agreement. The title of the post is misleading. It's all about increasing the sensitivity of the pedal, not in adjusting your throttle response.
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Jim Elbows-High Performance, LLC Home of the VentPod 2001 GT Bullitt Intake, VT Stage II cams, Hookers, J-Mod, PI3600, SFC's, LCA's, tubular front, rr seat delete, Scorpion racing seats, deep-dish out back.
Ohnosaez, I'm in agreement. The title of the post is misleading. It's all about increasing the sensitivity of the pedal, not in adjusting your throttle response.
Yes and no. It is adjusting the response time of the throttle. If it turns on faster.......
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Joined: 3/19/2005 From: Boston, MA Status: offline
The "surging" I think you're talking about happens with every manual Mustang... at least the V6's. Basically, if you're in true neutral (not just with the clutch depressed), and your car is still rolling, your idle revs will run up to 1500-2000 rpm. As soon as the vehicle stops moving, or when you press in the clutch, it drops back down to normal idle.
So far, no one has been able to eliminate this by tuning. I think the common understanding is that the car tries to keep the O2 sensors a certain temperature. As you may know, resistance increases as a circuit heats up. You may have exactly the same AFR exhaust running down your pipes, but if you measure the O2 signal at different temp ranges, you'll get different results. Therefore, the car is unable to make corrections accurately. The solution is to try and keep the O2 sensor an average temperature, that way, the resistance across the circuit is the same (or close to it) at all times. This allows for more accurate fuel trims corrections.
Think about it, the idle surge happens more in the first few minutes you drive the car. After a while, the surging slows down, or even stops.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Daniel60
My question to readers is does your car surge as well?
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Need less to say i like the idea of just being able to just tap the pedal and the car responds rater than having to press the pedal to get a responce.
I agree. It is something you just get used to though. Ours has a slight hesitation when cold first thing in the morning. It is getting down to 40* now at night and it is just a littl cold blooded. We don't give it much warm up time. Just a back down the driveway and wait for the garage door to close. Once we get down to the stop sign, it goes away. I may try gramps' idea with the spacer first.
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Anyone have any Ford documentation describing how this switch operates and how to test it ... this should show voltage #'s in correlation to throttle movement.
As far as ECU reset with every start... so you are saying that if I start the car with the throttle depressed 1/2 way down ... The ECU will adjust this to be closed throttle (idle)? Then when I let off the pedal I assume car will stall because it will go negative throttle?
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Joined: 3/19/2005 From: Boston, MA Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: dmhines
As far as ECU reset with every start... so you are saying that if I start the car with the throttle depressed 1/2 way down ... The ECU will adjust this to be closed throttle (idle)? Then when I let off the pedal I assume car will stall because it will go negative throttle?
Damn, sounds like an analog Nintendo controller. Your dude is running crazy all over the screen if you hold the joystick when powering on the system. Hahah.... That's ok in video games. Not so much in cars....
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ProCharger Stage II D1SC @ 14 psi SSM Stage 3 heads and cams 440 RWHP/388 RWTQ Tuned by Doug at B@m@Chips!
Well I have to disagree about what some are saying. After my custom dyno tune my car is so responsive it wants to leap forward instantly when I touch the gas pedal. I have to be more aware in traffic so I don't rear-end a slow poke taking off at a light. I think this might be why Ford set it up the way they did so that people with less driving skill do not get into trouble. I understand your take on the mechanical aspect but in my case the car has become very responsive. It may be that there are variations in every car as these fine adjustments can create wide spread variations in performance.
My neighbor came home from Nam and bought a 69 corvette w/ a 427. Wrecked it. Then bought a 1970 Chevelle, SS454 and wrecked it. Just kept sliding off the road with them.
Could very well be. I know that after Vietnam, our boys came home with a pocket full of money (maybe not a pocket full) and bought Bosses and GT's and Mach's. Many ended up in the ditch dead. Something the Gooks couldn't do. It was determined that they were not used to driving beasts and couldn't handle them.
Anyone have any Ford documentation describing how this switch operates and how to test it ... this should show voltage #'s in correlation to throttle movement.
As far as ECU reset with every start... so you are saying that if I start the car with the throttle depressed 1/2 way down ... The ECU will adjust this to be closed throttle (idle)? Then when I let off the pedal I assume car will stall because it will go negative throttle?
Something to think about. Go try it and report back if you're not in an ambulance.
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Posts: 11057
Joined: 9/16/2006 From: Fishers, IN Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: wingman75
Well I have to disagree about what some are saying. After my custom dyno tune my car is so responsive it wants to leap forward instantly when I touch the gas pedal. I have to be more aware in traffic so I don't rear-end a slow poke taking off at a light. I think this might be why Ford set it up the way they did so that people with less driving skill do not get into trouble. I understand your take on the mechanical aspect but in my case the car has become very responsive. It may be that there are variations in every car as these fine adjustments can create wide spread variations in performance.
I agree, with my tunes the car is instantly responsive....there might be a small "gap" that the pedal goes down before it takes off, but hell if it wasnt there then i would probably be rear ended all the folks that let the car accelerated them off the line instead of using the gas......i would be very careful when doing this if you already have your car tuned properly.
Well I have to disagree about what some are saying. After my custom dyno tune my car is so responsive it wants to leap forward instantly when I touch the gas pedal. I have to be more aware in traffic so I don't rear-end a slow poke taking off at a light. I think this might be why Ford set it up the way they did so that people with less driving skill do not get into trouble. I understand your take on the mechanical aspect but in my case the car has become very responsive. It may be that there are variations in every car as these fine adjustments can create wide spread variations in performance.
My neighbor came home from Nam and bought a 69 corvette w/ a 427. Wrecked it. Then bought a 1970 Chevelle, SS454 and wrecked it. Just kept sliding off the road with them.
Could very well be. I know that after Vietnam, our boys came home with a pocket full of money (maybe not a pocket full) and bought Bosses and GT's and Mach's. Many ended up in the ditch dead. Something the Gooks couldn't do. It was determined that they were not used to driving beasts and couldn't handle them.
I know. It got so bad that they took that blown stang on a tour of Nam to educate the boys on how to drive them. They even raced it down the flight deck of the Midway I believe. That car sold on ebay a few years back. It was still a monster. They took 3 of em over there, but wrecked 2 of them. Helocoptor dropped one of them.
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2007 GT Coupe Premium Windveil Blue, 3.31, Auto, 18" Fanblades, Interior Upgrade, Active Anti-Theft, Side Bags, Leather, K&N Drop-in, Splash Guards, 14" Antenna, Rolled Tips, Born on date...3/07
Anyone have any Ford documentation describing how this switch operates and how to test it ... this should show voltage #'s in correlation to throttle movement.
As far as ECU reset with every start... so you are saying that if I start the car with the throttle depressed 1/2 way down ... The ECU will adjust this to be closed throttle (idle)? Then when I let off the pedal I assume car will stall because it will go negative throttle?
If you read what I said earlier, there is a LIMIT to how far it will calibrate. Just like with your car's fueling and O2 sensors, if the ECU sees the O2 sensor as reading lean, it will add more fuel UP TO A POINT. After that point, it will stop adding fuel, and throw a check engine light.
Because we are making such small changes, the ECU can compensate for the small change in resistance.
This is why there are SIX tracks, so the ECU can compare all the outputs from the pads, and calibrate the pedal. It would work just as well to only have one carbon track and one brush.
Anyway, this physically removed all deadspace from my pedal, worked perfectly for me. I'll take a video when I get home of how sensitive it is.
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Anyone have any Ford documentation describing how this switch operates and how to test it ... this should show voltage #'s in correlation to throttle movement.
As far as ECU reset with every start... so you are saying that if I start the car with the throttle depressed 1/2 way down ... The ECU will adjust this to be closed throttle (idle)? Then when I let off the pedal I assume car will stall because it will go negative throttle?
If you read what I said earlier, there is a LIMIT to how far it will calibrate. Just like with your car's fueling and O2 sensors, if the ECU sees the O2 sensor as reading lean, it will add more fuel UP TO A POINT. After that point, it will stop adding fuel, and throw a check engine light.
Because we are making such small changes, the ECU can compensate for the small change in resistance.
This is why there are SIX tracks, so the ECU can compare all the outputs from the pads, and calibrate the pedal. It would work just as well to only have one carbon track and one brush.
Anyway, this physically removed all deadspace from my pedal, worked perfectly for me. I'll take a video when I get home of how sensitive it is.
Good answer.
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Right, because those are the negatives, while the ones without gold underneath the entire thing are the actual resistors. There are really only THREE sets of resistors, as each one has a + and - connection. Truly you could just bend the brushes on the ones without gold underneath them and get the same effect, but you should do them all for consistency as you want them all to be at the same height so they rub the same.
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RE: DIY THROTTLE RESPONSE MOD (MUST SEE!) - 
