Ok, im stuck in a bit of a rut.
As of late my grades arent too grand and so per my driving privilege deal with my dad if im not getting a 3.0 my priviledges are revoked. So that leaves me with a multitude of options and to every negative theres a few positives depending on how you look at it. I just got a job and will be making a pretty good amount. Now that leaves me with those options.

1. Keep my mustang, keep paying insurance and not driving it for about a month or so. But save up money and put mod after mod on it while im not filling it up etc.
2. Sell my mustang for every cent that its worth and use that money to buy a car with more power.
3. Use the money from selling my mustang+whatever i have saved to buy a Later bodystyle Fox with a 5.0 and mod it with what i have (insurance probably wont raise too much if i got quoted bout the same rate on a late80s Camaro with a V8 it should be the same im guessing)
4. Use the money to buy a 70s Camaro and mod it with whatever ive got left.

Now gas for sure would cost me more on both of them, but if ive got a steady income it shouldnt be too much of a problem earning a fair wage. The same goes for insurance although i can see it costing MORE for me to get the Camaro.

My big question is what choice do you think would be the best formy situation, financially and rationally. Im just looking for more power and that sweet V8 rumble, i understand this car wont last a life time, but what qualitydomestic sports/muscle cardoes lol?and btw id be making ABOUT $700+ (give or take)a month IF and only if i get all the hours i requested and work almost full time on the weekends.

So the reason i ask you (even tho i realize this is rather off topic) is because i trust all you and know all you a lil bit better than those in the off topicsectionor in the GTsectionand so on.

Well if it were me I probably would sell her and get a 99+ GT or a 96-98 Cobra.
You can probably get 4-5k easily out of your car and a 96-98 Cobra will cost about $7-8k depending on where you shop. A 99+ GT has come down quite a bit too to right around 8-10k.

Now I said that I would because I already have my projects and more than enough stangs in my corral right now. It may not be wise for you. You need to ask yourself if you can make the extra $2-4k to get one of those cars and how long it will take you.

Shopping around is very imporant, you will get screwed every time you go to a dealership and they try to act like they are doing you a favor because they paid some kid min wage to clean your car and do a lube check. The last time I went in to look at Mach1's the guy tried to justify a 27,000 dollar 60k mile Mach1 that had some crappy american racing rims on it "But Sir, we detailed the car and changed the fluid, that there is worth the extra cost." I told him to get his ass on ebay and check them out for $15-20k. He said he would buy each one that he say on ebay for that price because he cant get them that cheap.

I asked him to let me open up my e-bay on his computer and he refused and proceded to say that those were private high risk sellers that dont have warenties. I then asked him why the car said it was As-Is and he said "Oh we dont give a warenty direct from us, its factory." I pointed out that almost all on ebay had factory warenties. Then I left.

Private sellers are the best place to shop, always and forever :D

As for the Camaro thing, I wouldnt touch a camaro unless it was a 67-73. My fav being the 70 1/2 RS-SS with the split bumper. Now that is nice!!! ( I miss my Chevelle :() Now if you had the money I would suggest a 98+ Z28/SS :)

But honestly I cant see myself owning another chevy for a long time. There are two cars I am going to try to go after and thats in, one being stupidly high in price and the other yet to come. Im talking about the Ford GT andthe NEWChallenger.

best of luck with your choice.

GET YOUR GRADES UP #1 priority.



Do whatever you want to do man. You always talk of building your sixer into a show car, but at the same time you crave more power, so that ones up to you. I will remind you of this, it will be very hard to find an old foxbody or camaro in good enough shape to be worth buying, then there's always gonna be the cost of making some type of repair, and your current car is running just fine and you know what it's problems are and aren't.

Now as you know, I took the gamble with my old V6 and bought my 95 5.0, I got real lucky on some things, but I had to pay, and am still paying, out the wazoo just to keep the car in great working order. Now mine isn't stock, so that causes some problems right there, and all of the problems were caused by the dumb previous owner, and that's a risk you're gonna have to take if you go that route. You know what my decision was, so now it's time to make yours.

I say you keep saving, thenwhen you have saved over $5,000, suddenly, you will no longer want to buy a car and will choose to keep saving.

That's not true, when I hit $5000 I bought my 5.0.;):D

Well if I had a dull red v6 I would've bought a new car as well - lol

Correction, dull, SLOW ASS, red v6.:D

Ok thanks for you input thus far guys. Also the reason i dont want to get a newer mustang is because Im lookin to keep it cheap and from my understanding theres alot of parts out there for foxbodies and classic stangs, id be fine with either one. Right now i just want a car with more muscle persay and i know my grades are important and they have risen but right now is my saving point, right now im saving my money and, i was just wondering if by the time my grades are back, if it would be a better idea to buy the Camaro or the Fox and just work on them since their more primative and i feel id probably learn more if i could do alot of the work myself, plus ive got three buddies with 70s/80s camaros and they know the engine pretty well so i could team up with them on some ideas. Also i ask because my school is FULL of mustangs, two classics, a 98 cobra, v6, vert, and numberous s197 GTs. So just thought A. getting something out of the norm would be fun, B. getting more power would be fun C. having a car that was more accessible would be the best of all.

The S197 has become too insanly popular and compedative pricing has put one in every kids hands that has a willing parent. LOL

Always work on your grades dude, I thought that was a given :)

well yes, my grades are increasing, but the selling would happen during the no driving period and the modifying and what not, and then id insure it when i get enough saved and THEN id drive it, over the summer and next year. Make it better that it was when i got it and sell it for more before i go to college.

I dont know how old you are but based on what you said I can guess that you are young, and being that you are young, you have the rest of your life to get the car you want. Get those grades up, get a good job and then when you are finacially stable you could purchase that car with more power to please your needs.

Do your parents care if you sell it?
I would personally keep it unless you are that set on getting a faster car.

i say just keep it, mod it as u go. wait till u get to college and really have some serious bills to pay, then ur gonna wanna shoot ur self if u get a new car that has payments and higher insurance. if u keep ur six u can mod it as u want when u have the money and plus u have already started a lil

Guys, the insurance will go down on an older V8, not up, trust me on this, been there, done that.

Full coverage 1998 Ford Mustang 3.8L, full coverage, $1800 every six months
Full coverage 1995 Ford Mustang GT/Cobra, full coverage, $1285 every six months.

I'm 21, so I still don't get that nice age discount.:(


Josh, like I said, do what you wish, but there are days, and they're counting, when I still wish I had my old V6 for a daily driver, or better yet, a freeking Civic. I swear, I feel like I'm being punished for owning a V8.[:'(]

okie dokie this is what you do. sell your pretty sixer save up and get a decent 4 eye foxbody :D. dont buy those 80's camaros with their crap 305's and uglyness.

i say just save up and spray ur car with like a nice 75-100 shot. do some more appearence stuff maybe get rims if you dont already have them or an exhaust system i know you were saying something about the "sound"

Ive got no clue what i should do.. I want more power, so i dont have to waste time/money on the six just so im not running 150hp... but gas wont be pretty right now im paying 40 bucks for 11.6 gallons and that lasts me about 250 something miles i think, but i feel working my hours and for my wage, driving two miles to school and back and the couple of miles down the hill to work and back up wont be too hard to substain some gas flowing thru the engine. Then theres insurance, wont cost too much hopefully, but roughly 700ish a month should net me a good 200/mo insurance (and thats if they want to charge me for the bigger engine/lack of safety features, right now im paying 180 or so for the 300/500 liability or w/e it is) So i figure i find a nice cheap workable muscle car (id be willing to go with almost anything with in reason ie.Camaro, chevelle, nova, maybe a vette that needs alil love, classic mustang etc.) something preferably that i dont have to worry about all this electrical crap, like tuning everything.. just so i can do some small swap. Honestly, i just want that mean V8 sound looks would be my 2nd need and in all honesty speed/power (not much use on 40mph roads) would just be something to toy with. It would be nice from time to time to beable to smoke the tires in front of the school.. show off.. run agaisnt some of the kids who think their hondas and nissan 240whatevers are the **** just kuz they have it dragging on the ground and a "special" japanese muffler and a stripped interior.... etc... but i reeeeaaallly want that sound and i really want to put a nice paint job on it the whole nine yards, so that maybe when i want to sell it it will have more value, maybe more miles, but most of all more value. I could then sell it for maybe a thousand more than i bought it for and use that money to buy a good college project. Right now the sixer is becoming a pain, i want to get the rear end pullin for me MAYBE some gears if im feeling up to the challenge, but for that id have to go in and mess with some electrical deal and pour money out to some technician who reads a manaul and has more tools than i do... I just dream of waking up on a saturday morning, walking out into the brisque spring air of Sammamish Washington popping the hood open giving the ol' v8 a once over, play with this check that, tinker here, turn it on revv it a few times, drive it down to the local XXX burger joint and sign up for the spring/summer car shows just cruise around. I dont like having to worry about pulling up to some stop light and have a honda who thinks hes the **** with his before mentioned car, pull up next to me and blow my doors off because ive got a mules instead of ponies.. I wouldnt mind so much throwing away money on my sixer if it wasnt so damn difficult. I mean ive got friends around me who own 70s Camaros, 80s camaros etc. and know their way around the engine, ive got one kid who got me hooked on the Camaro with his 75 whos currently adding another 4barrel to his engine... in all honesty all i know is that hes adding another carb with four holes in it... but he made it sound easy so i figure i could learn from him, and from experience, doesnt sound to hard you just find someone who knows and wants to help and go... ok ive typed too much now.. sorry..

Also i refuse to go nitrous... theres no reason for me to have it when i dont think ill be embarrassing myself at the track with my 6er. At most i was hoping to fo F/I but now im reading in magazines and here in the forum that ive got to bust my ass and my wallet with some tuner and finding some mechanic to tune it for me... just doesnt sound to fun in the end... I mean ive got HUGE plans for the 6er, but ive got even bigger dreams of ending my high school years in this rich snobby hell hole leaving giant ass tire marks on the walk way infront of the school.. just to be a douche bag.

you my friend need a carburetor. plain and simple. if you get a carb motor everything is less complicated and much cheaper to mod.

and your friend is putting dual 4 barrels on his camaro? how many inches is his motor [&:]. if its a 350 thats kind of a weird move [&:]

ORIGINAL: 85GTsleeper

you my friend need a carburetor. plain and simple. if you get a carb motor everything is less complicated and much cheaper to mod.


Well if he was really bored, he could covert the V6 over to a carbed engine.

No, because you cant have a carb in newer model cars... or at least thats my understanding from some law i read i think.. maybe its just Washington emission crap.. But Sleeper is right, its exactly what i need.. im tired of this electrical stuff thats slowing my progress. And i believe my friend has a 305 but im not sure, reguardless hes still lookin for more power.

Well, remember, you still have a lot of tinering to do with a carb, which will make it a little easier, but not much. In other words, you trade in the software for a screwdriver and lots of patience.

well as long as i can do it myself, ill put up some links of what im looking at, and what i have inquired about.

1969 Mustang
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/car/327310735.html

1969 Chevelle 4dr
http://seattle.craigslist.org/see/car/326592010.html

1976 Camaro (possible body damage? i emailed seller)
http://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/car/326242965.html

1976 Camaro (emailed seller about this one too)
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/car/325046897.html

1968 Lemans (for a GTO clone)
http://seattle.craigslist.org/see/car/327707210.html

I figure if i sell my car for 4000 ish, i should have money left over and money saved from workingfor the car, insurance and gas

Come on Josh, we're lazy, make thos links work.:D

there.. lol

good luck getting 4k for that car. unless you have really low miles, it ain't happenin.

76,000. and thanks, i will get it for 4K+.....
Updated list

1971 Camaro
http://seattle.craigslist.org/see/car/327231988.html
1978 Camaro (Its got a bad color but im going to repaint it black with white stripes.)
http://seattle.craigslist.org/skc/car/326805693.html

Boy, oh boy, going for the classics right off the bat. Plain and simple here, all of those cars, while OK, are restoration project cars, not something intended to be on the road day in and day out. I would just take a guestimation to say that to get the Mustang restored enough to drive everyday would cost around 10K, the Camaro (fugly as hell to me) about 10-15K, and the other two, I have no idea asto what to guess. Probles with those cars is gonna first off be the rust, then as a side job the paint would have to be done after the rust is fixed so you don't look like an ass driving down the street. Then you're on to fixing up the engine and tranny, not to modify, just to keep it running. Serriously, classic cars require a lot of time, money, and effort to keep them running and to get them to streetable status. Also, while all of those cars may be decently quick their handleing is gonna suck royal balls. You're gonna have to do some very nice suspension upgrades just so you can control the car in and out of turns.

The 71 looks good, but will need some major interior restoration, and the body will also need some work in the engine bay, and god knows where else.

The other Camaro doesn't look bad, but with only two pics advertising the body and not the rest of the car, I'd be worried.

Here are a couple I found, not as cheap, but won't need nearly as much work.

1995 5.0L White, 110,000 miles.
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/car/327661042.html

1996 Mustang GT, Green[:'(]127,000 miles[&:]
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/car/324269654.html

1988 Mustang LX 5.0L
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/car/327782397.html

1999 Mustang GT
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/car/324055738.html

1995 Camaro Z-28
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/car/327696868.html

1982 Camaro Z-28
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/car/327625594.html

1996 Mustang GT
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/car/327249570.html

And my favorite 1998 Mustang GT
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/car/324451520.html

dont want anything in the 80s+ really.

dont forget im looking for a carbbed engine

Well remember, the older, the more liability you're taking. Trust me on this, unless you "KNOW" without a doubt, that if something happens to your oldcar you can fix it, and that you "KNOW" you can begin the restoration right off the bat. Serriously, with you about to be going into college that's gonna be a huge hill to climb. My personal advice would be to keep your car now and continue on as planned, or buy another newer car. Remember, they made the ECU systems for a reason, because carbs also need tuning and you have to know what you're doing to tune them. Like I said, for an EFI you use a software system, for a carb you use a screwdriver with a lot of patience, not much of a trade off if you ask me. Only good thing about carbed engines is that they are easier to work on, but they still need tuning.

See this is where i get stuck.. I feel that if two of my friends can afford to drive these Camaros, and one of them knows a good deal about em and isgood with body and engine work,then i have a shot, but then on the other hand I dont know what would happen if i kept my 6er and beefed it up. I mean i was reading modified mustangs and theres a guy with a 93?5liter fox hatchback that runs like 14s and without ANY power adders modded the ass off the car and runs 12s. Now i know i wont be running 12s, but he did stuff that i cant even imagine to do, like new heads, drivetrain stuff.. things that if i bought id have no clue what to do, so id have to pay someone else like triple what i paid for the part inorder to have it installed and programmed in. Im stuck between the accesibility of the old engines (and the size), and taking the cheap route, but staying slow and paying a mechanic enough money to fill up his retirement fund within the month. Im going to write out a list of pros and cons... probably wont be very long, but it will still kinda map things out for me.

but just like u read to find out about this stuff u can read and find out how to install it. get a haynes maual and read it front to back. i also dont think that a resto car is a good choice

Well the only camaro thats a "resto" per say would be the 76 thats all primered and only 700 bucks, the blue 76 has some paint flake on the rear quarter but my friend whos got a 75 said he could take care of it easily, as id be sanding it all down to paint it black with light silver stripes ne way. Now the 71, yes it would be a project but think about it one of those cars thats been fixed up, nice paint job, new (custom) upholstery, my grandma runs her own upholstery business and she said if i gave her the seats to my mustang and we picked out some fabric she could put me together some new seat covers. Then ive got two friends with later 70s camaros who are both wanting me to get a camaro so they can help me with some problems too, ones a good mechanic and the other (who i just drove with for the first time today) is a bad ass driver, i mean, drifting around a round about in a 4 speed 74 with the fattest friggin tires ive ever seen isnt something alot of 17 year olds can do. So im not too worried about up keep on the engine or getting stuck anywhere.I figure i put my car up on craigs list for 4-5K ( i bought it for 3500 with ALOT of hidden damage that i took care of, spent probably 2000 more to repair all the big stuff ie. radiator, thermo, blinker, brakes, hood etc.) Put that money in the bank, ill be making about $200 a pay check (every 2 weeks) so if i put all that in the bank for a couple of weeks (only 5 1/2 more left in the school year), let it pool until its around 6ish (which will be roughly 2-3 weeks extra) buy the Camaro, for up to 3000 leaving me with roughly 3000 more, throw that into anything that needs repair (but of course ill test drive my choices first to make sure their running fine) leaving what ever is left to throw into insurance/gas. Then like i said, driving to school 10 miles a week then driving to work which isnt but 20 mins away from my house, ill probably have a good thing goin, i mean ill save driving for important trips, school, work, dates, ill try and keep the joy rides to a minimum lol. Plus like i said my birthday is comin up so go knows what will happen around then, maybe some more money, or some parts here or there adding to the pool. Believe it or not ive spent alot of time thinking about this.. maybe too much time, but it hasnt taken away from me studying. But like my current goal for my mustang (if im forced to take that route) is beef it up by next april for that stupid car show at my school just to show that domestics are still the kings no matter what the size of the engine (except for the redheaded stepchild 4cyls).

why would your buddy put dual 4 barrels on a 305 thats very unnecessary...i personally think you should get an 85 gt like mine hydr roller cam forged internals all you would really have to do is swap the 7.5 to an 8.8 w/3.73and do some suspenision work in the back then you got a quick street car and if you want to you can easily add nitrous like i did. also the 85's are getting harder to find and arent common like camaro's

Kuz it will go faster? I dont know lol I didnt really ask him it just sounded cool. Regaurdless, no offense but im not a fan of the 80ish mustangs. I can live with early 90s especially notchbacks, but those are f/i and i dont want f/i lol.

none taken im just saying it would be really easy for you to mod it and its reliable.

Yeah, but the only model i like is f/i and i dont want to deal with primative cpus id rather go with primative pig iron blocks lol. Im really leaning into this Camaro deal, however, ive got a guy trying to sell my a saleen front bumper and ive got 110 so thats what i offered him, maybe he will take it, maybe not, but its a step in both directions honestly. Saleen bumper for 110= better looks and a step in both directions for me honestly.

ORIGINAL: 85GTsleeper

you my friend need a carburetor. plain and simple. if you get a carb motor everything is less complicated and much cheaper to mod.


Why less cheaper? Thats what everbody says. An example?

ORIGINAL: xX98StallionXx

Yeah, but the only model i like is f/i and i dont want to deal with primative cpus id rather go with primative pig iron blocks lol. Im really leaning into this Camaro deal, however, ive got a guy trying to sell my a saleen front bumper and ive got 110 so thats what i offered him, maybe he will take it, maybe not, but its a step in both directions honestly. Saleen bumper for 110= better looks and a step in both directions for me honestly.


If you make a 5.0 Mustang F/I, there's not that much tuning that needs to be done, if any, because systems like Vortec and Procharger, come with miniature fuel management systems that do most, if not all, of the work for you.

Still want a classic muscle car lol, you can buy em cheap do a few things inside and out and uve got yourself a high priced machine u can sell later. My uncles neighbor has a 69 coupe which is in beautiful condition, its been for sale forever and im gonna look into it 2morrow. If not im going to shoot for a 70s Camaro.

why a camaro [&:]

Well,there isthe mustang with a 289... andthe camaro with a 350-305 or what a 327?... lol.

Actually, that depends. Older mustangs are 289, 302, 351, 428, and 429, semi old Mustangs are 302, and only the newer models are 289 specific.;):D

man if you aren't good at working on cars do not get a "classic" mustang, you have no idea how much time you will spend on the car to keep it running. i had a 66 mustang for 3 years and it required constant maintenance. i don't mean changing plugs either i mean the following

-rebuilt head
-replaced head gasket
-new pushrods
-new steering gear box
-new leaf springs
-new fuel pump
-new carbuerator
-half the electrical stuff wont' work...like horns and stuff
-new torque convertor
-new water pump
-new alternator

that's just what i remember off the top of my head. just realize that EVERY single weekend you will be tearing somehting off the car and replacing it, it is time consuming and very expensive. i did all the work myself and still every single cent i made in high school went into that car. my advice about friends who know how to work on cars is that they will help every once in awhile but you can't expect them to be over every weekend to help you on the car. you seriously don't know how reliable your late model mustang is until you get a classic. oh and btw our mustangs are incredibly easy to work on, they are RWD and an overhead valve engine design, yeah there is computer stuff but seriously for the most part our cars aren't that advanced. try working on a FWD overhead cam focus.

btw my advice is the same for anything in the 60's and 70's becuase those cars are 25-40 years old everything will be worn out.

-all suspension components
-drivetrain
-interior
-body

i mean you can fix them up but as jthorn said it requires you dedicated to restoring the car and not driving it

+1,000,000 to the above.

Well, I like to learn thru experience because not every classic is a pos lol. Ill chose wisely and test drive and get car reports.

no you are wrong every classic is what you could consider a POS. if you judge it by the standards you expect today it will be a huge POS. one question you should think about is...do you know what points are? and do you know how to set them?

i'm not trying to discourage you so much as i'm trying to make you realize what you will be getting yourself into. by saying you'll test drive and get car reports that tells me you have no idea what you are getting into. do you know how to tell the difference between body putty and metal just by looking at the car, or by tapping it iwth your hand? Are you going to be able to tell that the frame is rusted out even though the seller just put a nice coat of rust-oleum on it to make it look nice?

again not saying you can't do it, but you have to realize what a classic car is, an extremely worn out vehicle that unless you are spending over 10k will need a lot of work.

best of luck to you.

No I understand where ur coming from, but i bought my car for REALLY cheap.. and i know what ur talking about.. mine is a salvage rebuild title, the owner hid a cracked hood under a vinyl cover and a hole in the dash with a friggin dash carpet... alot with other things, i had to spend 1000 dollars extra for repairs.. believe me im pretty much ready for everything short of the transmission falling off lol. Regaurdless, i hope this car to be a project that i can take and make it worth more after im finished with it. I dont want anything too crappy but at the same time i dont want anything thats too built.

well i definitely wish you luck, i just didn't want to sugarcoat the advice, the last thing you want is to not know what you are getting into. as long as you understand the difficulty and work associated with the car you will learn a ton...and spend a ton lol :D but it will probably be worth it. i know i wish i still had that 66.

oh yeah, and im definitly eager to learn about it. I already learned some basics here and i guess its just time i found a project where i can learn more and apply what i know. But i do really help all ur advice.

On that note its come down to three.
1977 Camaro RS with a 305...
http://seattle.craigslist.org/est/car/331723485.html

1978 Z28 Camaro, from the looks id say it has a 350
http://seattle.craigslist.org/oly/car/331486195.html

and finally, 1977 Z-28 Camaro with a 350ci engine and a 350 turbo tranny
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/car/330328854.html

all i can say is a 77 TA with a four on the floor and 454 under the hood. then you don't have to worry about power

Kinda hard to find those for under 4K lol.

Camaro's are awesome...but I've always loved Firebirds/Trans Ams myself.

For some reason whenever I look around on Craigs list I always end up scoping out the Lesbos in my area. :(