RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6

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RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6

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Mustang >> Ford Mustang Tech >> 2005 - 2008 Mustangs >> 4.0L V6 Specific >> Drivetrain Performance >> RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6

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RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/13/2007 10:12:19 PM

Krazer

Posts: 166
Joined: 11/29/2006
Status: offline

Update on pricing for this swap.

I have been waiting for an e-mail from Dave on parts and cost of this swap and I been trying to avoid seeing him calling him for a couple reasons till I get his e-mail first. I also at the time told I wanted to do something with in the next three months so he was thinking no big hurry.

This guy in his e-mails goes into to so much detail (packed with good info) and I absorb so much good info from his e-mails and I always refer back to them for referencing info.

So I am thinking if I talk to him I won’t remember every thing he tells me, won’t be able to reference back like I can with his past e-mails and plus I wanted to have something to post for you guys with parts and costs and keep my word I would post his e-mail.

Well I couldn’t wait anymore so went over by him and discussed this swap. Ok he has 110% convinced me the Ford 03-04 Cobra motor (used) is the way to go if I do this swap and after talking with him I agree with out a doubt. I love the S/C 5.4 for a few reasons, brand new, warranty from Ford, can make exc. rwhp down the road with just throwing a KB on it and did I say I like brand new! But that aside the Cobra is the way to for a number of reasons he laid out and I see his points and completely agree imo.

So on to cost of this swap I know some guys might not believe it (imo on the low side of what I thought) but to do this swap with a used Cobra motor, all supporting parts needed and his labor I am looking at right around 10K. I am thinking to myself when he told me this wow that is less than I thought so I say to him you know that is reasonable. He said yeah I did a swap for a guy in an older Mustang we picked up a 03 Cobra motor with trans in MI for $5,500.00. he goes so if we can get a motor for around 5.5k – 6k your looking at around 10k total with parts and my labor and of course that is without the rear end.

I guess that is if I find one with a tranny if not need to add the cost of a tranny plus the 8.8 and D.S.

The one thing that doesn’t appeal to me is I have to go with a used motor then I have to find one and buy one where I could pick it up before I lay out the cash. The other thing who know how beat it is or if it was abused not brand new like the S/C 5.4 would of been

Speaking of buying a Cobra motor Check this, guys putting Cobra motors on e-bay for sale and sending you a picture of it after you pay them it instead of the motor.
http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2005/03/EditorsCorner/index.php

The other thing while I was waiting for his e-mail I was deciding well what other option for more rwhp for my little 4.0 will I go if I decide against the swap because there is no way I going stock again this summer.

So I did some research/thinking on what imo would be for me to go with and it is the X Charger I have X Charger fever. I mean this is fairly simple bolt on I could do myself, have a car that should run high 12’s (manual / 2.80&/w.i), awesome eye candy and since imo I don’t want to take this 4.0 motor past 9psi and stay around 310-320rwhp max on stock internals so this fits me perfect and these are just a few of the reasons I could go on.

Decisions decisions this sucks but is a good thing (nice problem to have) because what ever the option I am going to be rolling faster so I have to do some thinking on this.

Couple things real quick come to mind I like to share from talk with Dave.

Early 03 cobra motors had a bad head on one side 2 cylinders would over heat not good.
I didn’t know this these motors have 6 bolt mains I know he mention the techskid motor in the posted e-mail but I didn’t know the cobra did for sure.

Rygenstormlocke that 20% thingy in my last pm to you went up a little. :)

X

< Message edited by Krazer -- 1/14/2007 12:11:52 AM >

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2006 Pony Package S/C 5-spd

(in reply to Krazer)

Post #: 61

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/14/2007 8:21:11 AM

rygenstormlocke

Posts: 4816
Joined: 7/4/2005
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Well if a 12 second car is your goal, you can do that with the cobra motor, or with a blower on your current car. Except a blower on your current car will be a lot cheaper. For a track monster, the terminator swap sounds insane. What about labor costs, and fab costs to shoehorn the motor in.

_____________________________

Best 1/4: 10.97@122.09, 1.56 60ft w/4.0 V6
Best 1/4: 11.67@115.45, 1.64 60ft w/5.4 3V
Best 1/8: 7.401@92.77, 1.65 60ft w/5.4 3V
www.rygen.net/stang

(in reply to Krazer)

Post #: 62

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/14/2007 12:03:28 PM

Krazer

Posts: 166
Joined: 11/29/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rygenstormlocke

Well if a 12 second car is your goal, you can do that with the cobra motor, or with a blower on your current car. Except a blower on your current car will be a lot cheaper. For a track monster, the terminator swap sounds insane. What about labor costs, and fab costs to shoehorn the motor in.

rygenstormlocke my goal with the Cobra motor would be low 11's with a little work on (ported blower etc) the Cobra motor @ close to 500rwhp and the other thing down the road I have the option if I want to go faster of going with the KB blower hopefully putting down close to 600rwhp all on stock internals which this motor can handle no problem.

The 12 second car goal you mentioned is what I would like to run if I just keep the 4.0 and that is the max I want to push it on stock internals.
The one thing I don't like with the swap like I mentioned above post I would have to hunt down a used motor, pick it up, would need to find one locally within a few states so I could pick it up and pay at that time not going to send money though e-bay and hope it comes :). Who knows if its been abused, could have been popped and would I be getting something put back together poorly I mean so many things go through my head when thinking used. I am really just looking at this option right now the above is a big turn off for me. The S/C 5.4 buying brand new from Ford really appealed to me but if I going to do a swap the Cobra motor is the way to go for a number of reason he stated.

On your question on what cost and fab cost like I mentioned above around total 10k with motor and installed, thats if I get a used motor around 5.5K-6k with the supporting parts and labor to complete the swap would be around 4k so around 10k total. That total is with out the 8.8, DS and if I don't get a trans with the motor the trans also would not be included tin that total cost . He also mentioned that he hasn't look into doing this on a S197before but isn't seeing any problems off the top of his head on this type of swap but will be looking into it this week.

So like I mentioned in the PM to you before I had talked with Dave it was a 20% chance I would do this swap but after talking with Dave that percent went up a little esp around 10K complete but the used motor thing is bumming me out big time per my concerns above. So I don't know which way as of now. The X Charger setup is so simple, sweet and so much less to go though vs the above but I love the ideal of the Cobra V8(rwhp) swap also. I don't know I am going to think long and hard for the next week at the same time searching and making calls to see whats out there motor (used) wise.

< Message edited by Krazer -- 1/14/2007 12:18:13 PM >

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2006 Pony Package S/C 5-spd

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Post #: 63

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/14/2007 1:10:53 PM

rygenstormlocke

Posts: 4816
Joined: 7/4/2005
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Well, with the cobra swap, taking it in for maitenance might be a tad interesting. Not a big deal but something to consider. Have you ever considered putting the X on this car, and just getting a old project car like a Fox LX or even a old early 90s cobra. I'm still eyeing that Boss, but if its cost prohibitive, I will be going a old mustang project car route myself. Either way, there will be two mustangs in my garage soon.

Lastly, on a used motor, I wouldn't take it unless you get it magnafluxed for integrity. On my new block, PH had it tested before they started working it. The last thing you want is a block with a tiny fracture in it. I've heard of a few cobra guys over on m-odularfords with damaged blocks, just running thier blocks under low boost while they save up for a new motor.

< Message edited by rygenstormlocke -- 1/14/2007 1:11:48 PM >

_____________________________

Best 1/4: 10.97@122.09, 1.56 60ft w/4.0 V6
Best 1/4: 11.67@115.45, 1.64 60ft w/5.4 3V
Best 1/8: 7.401@92.77, 1.65 60ft w/5.4 3V
www.rygen.net/stang

(in reply to Krazer)

Post #: 64

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/14/2007 5:48:07 PM

Krazer

Posts: 166
Joined: 11/29/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rygenstormlocke

Well, with the cobra swap, taking it in for maitenance might be a tad interesting. Not a big deal but something to consider. Have you ever considered putting the X on this car, and just getting a old project car like a Fox LX or even a old early 90s cobra. I'm still eyeing that Boss, but if its cost prohibitive, I will be going a old mustang project car route myself. Either way, there will be two mustangs in my garage soon.

Lastly, on a used motor, I wouldn't take it unless you get it magnafluxed for integrity. On my new block, PH had it tested before they started working it. The last thing you want is a block with a tiny fracture in it. I've heard of a few cobra guys over on m-odularfords with damaged blocks, just running thier blocks under low boost while they save up for a new motor.

Yea on the maitenance thing no big deal as far as your other question project car I came over from the other side of the tracks (always GM) don’t have interest in doing an older Mustang I want to do something with a S197 & represent around here. I remember the first time I seen this new style S197 I had that deer in the headlight look! So this is the car and only one I want to play with and set up.

The Boss yes no doubt I was on that ideal for awhile but after hearing on forums that most likely going to be marked up who knows 40K-50K. That’s why when I saw the S/C 5.4 motor complete w/warr thinking man that’s it I could have my own SE/SVT. I could be happy with the rwhp this motor is capable (modded) for less money than a Boss and have it now and enjoy it for two years before the Boss even comes that out kind of put the Boss ideal out of my mind.

On having the block manufluxed Mike had yours manufluxed because it was stripped down (minus all internals) to the block and then that’s when you manuflux it then put it together and you B&B the motor. The Cobra motor would not be torn down there for ni manuflux it would go right in the car. The only thing before install would be done run some diag. checks,, inspect plugs, compression check in each cylinder, change the oil, drop the oil pan clean & inspect, check for metal clean it etc button it up and start the motor. Then if everything looks good then go ahead and drop it in the car and keep my fingers cross after the first couple hard runs. :)

I would tell you this if I knew of a Cobra motor right now locally within a few states and knew to be sound this would be a done deal for me to do this swap. But since it is not the case and chances are of me finding one as outlined above (sound) in the very near future is slim imo not going stock again this springs/summer want my car setup by this april the latest so I will most likely be signing up for the group buy.

I will say this even if I go X Charger and in the future I come across a Cobra motor that I know to be sound I could always just pull off the X and sell it I mean hey I should be able to sell it for 2k-2.5 it’s a nice system. So I lose around 1K or so you know very well in the grand scheme (building a 10-11 sec car) of this sport/hobby that is not a lot of money to worry about and would be no problem knowing I am stepping up to the Cobra motor.

Hey speaking of insane when do we get updated info and numbers (no #'s in the pm)on your ride talk about insane I just can’t wait to see what that 4.0 runs that thing could be consider a pro street machine imo but I know it’s a DD unreal.

< Message edited by Krazer -- 1/14/2007 6:39:48 PM >

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2006 Pony Package S/C 5-spd

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Post #: 65

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/15/2007 1:13:34 PM

rygenstormlocke

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Joined: 7/4/2005
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Thanks man. PH is building the remaining parts now, so will not have numbers for a few weeks. We decided to pretty much do it all, heads, cams, valves, everything. They really can do it all, I'm quite impressed. They did a custom roll cage for a GT turbo customer (Brads car), simply insane. Check it out: http://www.****/forums/2005-mustang/winter-powerhouse-mods-complete-71661.html

_____________________________

Best 1/4: 10.97@122.09, 1.56 60ft w/4.0 V6
Best 1/4: 11.67@115.45, 1.64 60ft w/5.4 3V
Best 1/8: 7.401@92.77, 1.65 60ft w/5.4 3V
www.rygen.net/stang

(in reply to Krazer)

Post #: 66

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/15/2007 2:50:17 PM

Krazer

Posts: 166
Joined: 11/29/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rygenstormlocke

Thanks man. PH is building the remaining parts now, so will not have numbers for a few weeks. We decided to pretty much do it all, heads, cams, valves, everything. They really can do it all, I'm quite impressed. They did a custom roll cage for a GT turbo customer (Brads car), simply insane. Check it out: http://www.****/forums/2005-mustang/winter-powerhouse-mods-complete-71661.html

I seen the laundry list at **** forum and of course in the pm lately the setup looks rock solid and since you’re the first we are going know how well a built 4.0 bottom end can hold some big time power! The last I remember I believe you were running 320rwhp/380rwtq I think, on a Mustang dyno. The thing that struck me with amazement is how you were closing in on the Powerhouse TC 4.0 ET (12psi/11.81 et) with an auto vs thier manual 5k launches, running 2psi lower and not even race gas like they were till your mishap that was killer imo.

So with that being said I look forward to seeing your numbers vs your old ones and what the psi your now going to be running on this setup.

Glad you don’t live in my area if I ever get that Cobra swap deal done I hate to have to go up against you and that monster.

Hey what an ideal!!! I could see it now

The Stella Monster V6 High Powered 4.0 rwhp UNKNOWN!!! Vs Shakia The High Flying V8 Powered Terminator RWHP UNKNOW!!!

We could bill it as the Classic V8 vs V6 S197 take down!!

LMAO don’t mind me just having some fun I think??? LoL
Dam let me find a motor ;) lol

I’d have to push some dam good rwhp/rwtq with the Eaton to have a chance.

< Message edited by Krazer -- 1/15/2007 2:53:46 PM >

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2006 Pony Package S/C 5-spd

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Post #: 67

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/15/2007 2:54:33 PM

rygenstormlocke

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Joined: 7/4/2005
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Very cool! Well you can have your chance, theres an event at Norwalk on April 27th that I'm going to. Thats in driving distance from you isn't it?

_____________________________

Best 1/4: 10.97@122.09, 1.56 60ft w/4.0 V6
Best 1/4: 11.67@115.45, 1.64 60ft w/5.4 3V
Best 1/8: 7.401@92.77, 1.65 60ft w/5.4 3V
www.rygen.net/stang

(in reply to Krazer)

Post #: 68

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/15/2007 3:03:53 PM

Krazer

Posts: 166
Joined: 11/29/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rygenstormlocke

Very cool! Well you can have your chance, theres an event at Norwalk on April 27th that I'm going to. Thats in driving distance from you isn't it?

Just having some fun looks like I will be going with the X Charger most likely for now but the swap could happen down the road all I neeed is to find a good solid Cobra motor at around 5k-6k.

_____________________________

2006 Pony Package S/C 5-spd

(in reply to rygenstormlocke)

Post #: 69

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/15/2007 3:05:55 PM

rygenstormlocke

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Joined: 7/4/2005
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I know, but seriously, would be cool to meet up at a track. Its a lot of fun meeting forum members at the track. Either way, your car will be awesome.

_____________________________

Best 1/4: 10.97@122.09, 1.56 60ft w/4.0 V6
Best 1/4: 11.67@115.45, 1.64 60ft w/5.4 3V
Best 1/8: 7.401@92.77, 1.65 60ft w/5.4 3V
www.rygen.net/stang

(in reply to Krazer)

Post #: 70

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/15/2007 3:22:30 PM

cookiemonster

Posts: 242
Joined: 11/13/2006
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Arrgh .. it's annoying when people say "touch base"

- it really doesn't mean anything .... ok I'm done ranting, back on topic.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Krazer
I just wanted to touch bases with you

(in reply to Krazer)

Post #: 71

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/15/2007 3:48:31 PM

Krazer

Posts: 166
Joined: 11/29/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rygenstormlocke

I know, but seriously, would be cool to meet up at a track. Its a lot of fun meeting forum members at the track. Either way, your car will be awesome.

I apprecaite the invite will touch bases with you later on that.

for cookie monster ^^^ lol just joking :)

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2006 Pony Package S/C 5-spd

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Post #: 72

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/15/2007 6:08:24 PM

Jerseyfury2

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Joined: 4/21/2006
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if you wanna do something really out of the ordinary and original. Buy that 500hp boss 302 crate motor when it comes out from Ford! That's what I would love to do.

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05 Mineral Gray v6 AUTO-modded
03 black cobra-my little animal
03 silver cobra-modded

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Post #: 73

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/15/2007 6:10:08 PM

rygenstormlocke

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Joined: 7/4/2005
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The hurricane motor? I thought it was 390ish HP. But yea, the Boss will be awesome no doubt.

_____________________________

Best 1/4: 10.97@122.09, 1.56 60ft w/4.0 V6
Best 1/4: 11.67@115.45, 1.64 60ft w/5.4 3V
Best 1/8: 7.401@92.77, 1.65 60ft w/5.4 3V
www.rygen.net/stang

(in reply to Jerseyfury2)

Post #: 74

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/15/2007 6:46:49 PM

Krazer

Posts: 166
Joined: 11/29/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jerseyfury2

if you wanna do something really out of the ordinary and original. Buy that 500hp boss 302 crate motor when it comes out from Ford! That's what I would love to do.

Yes I know about the Boss 302 since Sept or October its been reported and talked about on TMS but like you said not out yet. The Cobra motor is capable of running around 600rwhp (670hp)with a KB and if one wanted looking at around 750rwhp (830hp) if you want to add nitrous so this motor will satisfy my power needs (& wallet bang for the buck) with no problem, since I looked into this motor as of late I am sold on this motor for the swap just have to find the right one.

< Message edited by Krazer -- 1/15/2007 7:40:16 PM >

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2006 Pony Package S/C 5-spd

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Post #: 75

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/15/2007 7:04:55 PM

Krazer

Posts: 166
Joined: 11/29/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rygenstormlocke

The hurricane motor? I thought it was 390ish HP. But yea, the Boss will be awesome no doubt.

That 500hp Jersyfury is quoting is flywheel not rwhp also Ford decided to change the name of the new motors from Hurricane to Boss as of late.

< Message edited by Krazer -- 1/15/2007 7:09:00 PM >

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Post #: 76

RE: Complete GT 500 Supercharged 5.4 in a V6 - 1/25/2007 11:01:35 AM

DelStang86

Posts: 383
Joined: 10/12/2006
Status: offline

i'm really liking that boss 302... so many displacement and head options... you could always just buy the block (1759$.. cheap as hell) go with the ford racing z heads, fr500 valvetrain, etc etc and make a hell of a lot of horsepower more than a 4.6 would any day. if you chose that route you could build it piece by piece with no pressure and swap it in when you have all the other things you need (8.8 rear, new trans, etc). I'm considering this for a couple years down the road (after school)

(in reply to Krazer)

Post #: 77