""Right.... two drivers in the same zip code with the same cars.... one has a clean record, the other has and accident and 2 tickets. They pay the same. Right. ""
I said based on zip code, not driving record. Two guys with an accident and two tickets (identical record) will pay different rates based upon zip code location, not their driving record. Sure they will pay more because of their record. But *identical* records vary widely based on zip code. The majority of your premium in CA is based on zip code. Several years ago we passed a constitutional amendment banning insurance companies from this practice. It has been fought in court and is still being fought in court. AAA has now said that in December they will start following the law and will primarily base premiums on driving record rather than zip code. You can google all this if you want to. :)
Team MF Member #028 Posts: 4272
Joined: 5/11/2005 From: Newark, DE USA Status: offline
quote:
Revolver Date 7/27/2006 4:36:20 PM
[snip]
I guarantee you if I lived in Southern cali I could walk into a Ford dealership today and leave with a GT for 24k. Never go by what the dealer has advertised on sticker, or on the windshield. It's BS and overpriced. You calculate your own fair profit off of the research you do online, bring it all in, and show the salesman and say he can either take a check for 5% profit or leave it but somebody will take it. And someone will take it because it's nothing for a dealer to simply order more Mustangs to fill depleted inventories.
I think most of you guys have lost site of this thread. This isn't your average GT is better than V6 thread. This is a thread questioning the practicality of buying a v6 and spending thousands to make it look like a clone GT, when you could just shop around and find a GT for cheaper. PS: Maybe somebody could explain this to me, but how does depreciation cost you money out of your pocket? If I buy a GT for $24k and it depreciates $14k over 5 years, it didn't cost me an extra $14k to own it, it _only_ cost me $14k because I'm reselling it for $10k.
Will anyone else beat me to it as I type???
Revolver, several others have responded to your original inquiry, and made the following points:
It doesn't cost thousands to add GT take-off parts to our V6 cars.
Most people here who install GT take-off parts on their cars are not trying to pass them off as a GT. Posers make up a very small percentage of the people out there. We add GT parts (and from other aftermarket companies) to personalize our vehicle - for looks, speed, whatever.
Nearly eveyone on this forum frowns on people who modify their cars for the purpose of making it look like something its not. It could be making a V6 look like a GT, or a Saleen, or a Rousch. Tribute cars are a different story, but nobody here likes posers.
I'll let somebody else answer your question on depreciation.
The botom line: We modify our 4.0L S197 Mustangs because we want them to look and perform according to our own taste and style.
< Message edited by 28hopup -- 7/27/2006 4:55:08 PM >
_____________________________
Best 60'' .... 1.906 Best 1/8 ... 9.141 @ 76.29 Best 1/4 ... 14.312 @ 95.67
You will not find a brand new GT in SoCal for anything less than $27K. I was at the local dealership this past few weeks getting my stang fixed, walked through the showroom floor and GTs there were $29K and $30K. A GT-CS 'vert was $37K.
In any case, I could afford the monthly payments for a GT and couldn't even begin to afford the insurance. Now I can afford it, I've doubled my income since.
My V6 cost me $21K, up to $26K after taxes, financing (I only put $1K down), etc. And it only cost me $400 for GT bumpers, and $300 for magnaflows.
I guarantee you if I lived in Southern cali I could walk into a Ford dealership today and leave with a GT for 24k. Never go by what the dealer has advertised on sticker, or on the windshield. It's BS and overpriced. You calculate your own fair profit off of the research you do online, bring it all in, and show the salesman and say he can either take a check for 5% profit or leave it but somebody will take it. And someone will take it because it's nothing for a dealer to simply order more Mustangs to fill depleted inventories.
I think most of you guys have lost site of this thread. This isn't your average GT is better than V6 thread. This is a thread questioning the practicality of buying a v6 and spending thousands to make it look like a clone GT, when you could just shop around and find a GT for cheaper.
PS: Maybe somebody could explain this to me, but how does depreciation cost you money out of your pocket? If I buy a GT for $24k and it depreciates $14k over 5 years, it didn't cost me an extra $14k to own it, it _only_ cost me $14k because I'm reselling it for $10k.
And I think you've completely ignored the plain math I provided you with...oh well. This thread is like the whole auto vs manual thread. You won't concede until everyone says "whatever you say" regardless of the facts posted. Sorry, I'll take my V6 along with the 3-4 K i saved over a gt PLUS the difference in the cost of ownership 7K, throw on some body mods for 1k that make it look like a gt (if that's your taste) and then take 3-5 K for a S/C or T/C and leave the GT like it was standing still. Oh wait..the extra 3-4K in my pocket will add weight so I'll throw it out the window to make the GT guy feel better
as for your post for regarding depreciation not costing you anything...you my friend are a prime example while this country is so far in debt and how people over extend themselves. I'm sure you can name at least ONE thing you could've done with that extra 14K (or the difference in depreciation between the GT and V6) Did you work for Enron by chance?
""Right.... two drivers in the same zip code with the same cars.... one has a clean record, the other has and accident and 2 tickets. They pay the same. Right. ""
I said based on zip code, not driving record. Two guys with an accident and two tickets (identical record) will pay different rates based upon zip code location, not their driving record. Sure they will pay more because of their record. But *identical* records vary widely based on zip code. The majority of your premium in CA is based on zip code. Several years ago we passed a constitutional amendment banning insurance companies from this practice. It has been fought in court and is still being fought in court. AAA has now said that in December they will start following the law and will primarily base premiums on driving record rather than zip code. You can google all this if you want to. :)
I have experience with that...My insurance went UP by 100 every six months with the same insurance carrier because any Zip in the Phoenix area is deemed at higher risk for being stolen than where I used to live in Cali. Same car, same record, same person. Just moved. It's finally gone downa bit since I've been here but I was pissed.
Carol Shelby HIMSELF said that he liked his CS6 ( his version of a s/c s197 v6) more than the v8, because the v6 has LESS wheight up front and gives the v6 a much more balanced feel. I couldnt afford the v8, and the insurance, and cant wait to mod my mustang and go scca club racing..... and hopefully win against a more powerfull v8, as long as the v8 isnt aluminum i'll be ok.
You know it occurred to me that there sure is a lot of GT take-off parts in the open market. Maybe there's a conspiracy among the GT owners. They're cloning all their cars to look like something it's not - oh-my-God they may all be profiting from selling take-off's to V6ers and all the time they're spending extra bucks making themselves Rousch or Saleen Clones. Why! Why! Why! Revolver - you must go to all GT Sites and tell them we are on to their scheme!
I guarantee you if I lived in Southern cali I could walk into a Ford dealership today and leave with a GT for 24k. Never go by what the dealer has advertised on sticker, or on the windshield. It's BS and overpriced. You calculate your own fair profit off of the research you do online, bring it all in, and show the salesman and say he can either take a check for 5% profit or leave it but somebody will take it. And someone will take it because it's nothing for a dealer to simply order more Mustangs to fill depleted inventories.
yup 24k but you could do that to the v6 too and it would still be 6000 difference
quote:
ORIGINAL: Revolver
I think most of you guys have lost site of this thread. This isn't your average GT is better than V6 thread. This is a thread questioning the practicality of buying a v6 and spending thousands to make it look like a clone GT, when you could just shop around and find a GT for cheaper.
Not really...we have answered your questions, it is cheaper to Mod the V6 to make it quicker and make it look better than a GT than buying one. How many answers you want?
Here:
it is cheaper to Mod the V6 to make it quicker and make it look better than a GT it is cheaper to Mod the V6 to make it quicker and make it look better than a GT. Most people here are not trying to clone GTs, just make their V6 look better! it is cheaper to Mod the V6 to make it quicker and make it look better than a GT. Most people here are not trying to clone GTs, just make their V6 look better. it is cheaper to Mod the V6 to make it quicker and make it look better than a GT. Most people here are not trying to clone GTs, just make their V6 look better.
You will not find a brand new GT in SoCal for anything less than $27K. I was at the local dealership this past few weeks getting my stang fixed, walked through the showroom floor and GTs there were $29K and $30K. A GT-CS 'vert was $37K.
In any case, I could afford the monthly payments for a GT and couldn't even begin to afford the insurance. Now I can afford it, I've doubled my income since.
My V6 cost me $21K, up to $26K after taxes, financing (I only put $1K down), etc. And it only cost me $400 for GT bumpers, and $300 for magnaflows.
I guarantee you if I lived in Southern cali I could walk into a Ford dealership today and leave with a GT for 24k. Never go by what the dealer has advertised on sticker, or on the windshield. It's BS and overpriced. You calculate your own fair profit off of the research you do online, bring it all in, and show the salesman and say he can either take a check for 5% profit or leave it but somebody will take it. And someone will take it because it's nothing for a dealer to simply order more Mustangs to fill depleted inventories.
I think most of you guys have lost site of this thread. This isn't your average GT is better than V6 thread. This is a thread questioning the practicality of buying a v6 and spending thousands to make it look like a clone GT, when you could just shop around and find a GT for cheaper.
PS: Maybe somebody could explain this to me, but how does depreciation cost you money out of your pocket? If I buy a GT for $24k and it depreciates $14k over 5 years, it didn't cost me an extra $14k to own it, it _only_ cost me $14k because I'm reselling it for $10k.
Revolver, I have a great idea. Take this over to a GT site and ask them why they paid over $24K for a GT. Maybe you can give them a lesson on negotiating skills and dealer markup. Those Dealers! Imagine being in business to make a profit. Ridiculous concept!
Wow dude, what's with the negativity? Bad day or something?
Anyway there's nothing wrong with dealer's profiting. There's profiting and then there's PROFITING. Do you feel it's a more fair deal to give a dealer a 5% profit when most retailers make 1-3% or do you feel it's more fair to give a dealer 20% profit or $8,000? I'm more concerned about my own finances and wallet than their downpayment on their new $700,000 home :)
Posts: 753
Joined: 3/16/2006 From: Rancho Cucamonga, CA Status: offline
The Dealers in SoCal, especially last summer when I bought my car, marked up the 05's like crazy. Just getting them back down to a normal sticker price was crazy. All that was on the lots last summer were Vert GT's that were going for a rediculous $35-42k. They were all fully loaded with 20"s and looked sweet but christ, $40k for a Mustang! Tell you what, if you can bring those dealers down from $35K to $25 I'll trade my 6 in tomorrow and buy that car on the spot.
does anybody here have a s197 v6 running deep in the 12's?
All it takes it time. Right now, I'm sticking with 8.5lbs of boost to prove that 12's are possible at low boost. Then I will up the boost and meet you in the deep 12's.
_____________________________
Best 1/4: 10.97@122.09, 1.56 60ft w/4.0 V6 Best 1/4: 11.67@115.45, 1.64 60ft w/5.4 3V Best 1/8: 7.401@92.77, 1.65 60ft w/5.4 3V www.rygen.net/stang
The Dealers in SoCal, especially last summer when I bought my car, marked up the 05's like crazy. Just getting them back down to a normal sticker price was crazy. All that was on the lots last summer were Vert GT's that were going for a rediculous $35-42k. They were all fully loaded with 20"s and looked sweet but christ, $40k for a Mustang! Tell you what, if you can bring those dealers down from $35K to $25 I'll trade my 6 in tomorrow and buy that car on the spot.
My mother just bought a brand new 2006 nissan maxima two weeks ago and I went with her to negotiate it. Before we had done all our research we went to a dealer to test drive it out and price options. That dealer told us that the 06 Maxima is in high demand and because the 07s are coming, there are very few 06s left. He said most dealers are charging an overhead in addition to MSRP, but he would be kind enough to just charge us sticker price. Aww.. how sweet. We told him "we'll think about it." Went home, researched, went to another dealer and got the car for $700 below invoice, or $3200 below sticker price.
I can't really speak for when the 05s first come out because when a new model comes out, dealers can sometimes get stock of them early, so they'll mark them up since the car is rare at that point in time and I do believe that the 05 was very in demand once the new body style was released. But last summer there were _plenty_ of 05s in stock with the 06s about to arrive so their markup was unjustified. But I do promise you that I can go into your socal dealer tomorrow and get you a GT for 24k easy, assuming there isn't any extra charges added on for california emissions, but if there is, subtract that charge and you'll end up with 24k.
It's really not hard, and it's something you can do yourself. Go to edmunds.com and build the car with options you want and it will give you the MSRP, dealer invoice, and a TMV that shows what other people are paying (ignore that part). Take the dealer invoice, subtract a 3% holdback off of MSRP, subtract the factory rebate, and find out if there are factory to dealer incentives and subtract that too. Subtract the destination charge as well. Take that final figure, add 5% of it to the total, add back in the destination charge, and there you will have a good deal, and a fair profit to the dealer. Take all your paper work, walk right into the salesroom and ask to speak to the manager if possible. Show him all your paper work, tell him the exact color and options you want (if they don't have it they can find one) explain you're offering him a 5% profit and show him your figure. Tell him it's yes or no, non negotiable or you'll walk and someone will take that deal. Tell him it's a fast and easy sale and it's either he can make the money or he doesn't.
And there you have it. Brand new GT for 24k or less.
I'm sorry man but you are just s*****. Whatever that word is, use your imagination. You wanted to know why we didn't get a GT, we have given you numerous answers. This is not rocket science. Forget the the "CURRENT" deals on GTs because it's over, we already have V6 Mustangs. We can't just go to the dealers and trade in our Mustangs.
This guy still does not get it..... you can strut around all you want and say you'll walk... if he has 2 in stock, he'll let you walk and sell it to somebody tomorrow. If he has 11 in stock, he'll run after you.
I cant believe it!!!! Me and Cain called this over 12 hrs ago you were get over it move on
_____________________________
When he opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature saying, "Come and see!" And behold, a black horse, and he who sat on it had a balance in his hand.
This guy still does not get it..... you can strut around all you want and say you'll walk... if he has 2 in stock, he'll let you walk and sell it to somebody tomorrow. If he has 11 in stock, he'll run after you.
That is absolute BS. If they only have two in stock they can do a dealer to dealer search and locate the one you want and have it shipped over usually for a fee of around $100. And if they can't find the exact one you want they can just order one from the factory at no additional cost to them. They are more desperate for the sale than you are for the car. You have the power here, not them, even if you were buying a Ferrari. They may put on an act like they're doing you a BIG FAVOR by selling you the car at sticker price, but it's all just sales tactics to increase their pockets. One you show them you've done your research and you're firm and confident in your offer, they'll take it.
< Message edited by Revolver -- 7/28/2006 9:55:06 AM >
Printable Version
RE: Why not just get a GT? - 
get over it move on
