Posts: 20
Joined: 3/20/2003 From: United States Status: offline
I agree with devins. I also do not hate all imports. Just those civics and accords. My philosophy is that if in the cars description it says sportscar, or something along those lines, I respect it. It does not matter if it can beat me or not, as long as it is an actual sports car like a supra, or an eclipse, I respect it. I feel that people who hate cars just for the reason that is is made in Japan, is not a good reason.
Posts: 2199
Joined: 3/31/2003 From: United States Status: offline
Quote: Originally posted by 351stang on 10 April 2003 *looks and wonders how pathetic someone is for pretending to step up on a soapbox??, and making gay little astrics to sybolize him doing it*
A. the turbocharged 300zx engine at higher than stock boost levels makes much more torque than horsepower. i know b/c i dynoed 376rwhp and 405rwtq at 14psi of boost on stock turbos. on the n/a motor it will make a difference off the line 1/4 racing from a stop, but from a roll the 222hp z engine is going to start pulling and passing the stang. nobody said they were going from a stop did they?
B. i have built several 5.0's, and you are the one who needs to do the research. the cast crank on the 5.0, will not last long at all at 500hp, and the injectors wont make it nowhere near that far. when tuning a turbocharged engine to its peak, you will encounter detonation and its all over for the pistons, crank, or rods at some point. your never gonna get 500hp reliably like a z motor. PERIOD. as for the 750hp, you can just reread above about the 500hp.
C. i know more about this motor than you think. my conclusions arent based on asumtions, they are based on working in a machine shop for 6 years, and watching motor after motor come in, and hearing the stories about what happened to them. in *stock* form they have more displacement, but alot less potential because they are not as strong as the z's all forged internals. now in modified form, you can do more with the 5.0 b/c of the aftermarket, but i never said anything about the motor not having potential in modified form, they just SUCK in stock form. and you are the moron for not realizing that.
thank you for making a FOOL of YOURSELF, b/c your ignorance has really made for a good laugh. when you know what your talking about please come back again. until thin STFU, AND SIT DOWN.
sincerely,
YOUR OWNER
Wanna get technical? A turbo engine isn't what the rated displacement is. Ask any engineer, turbo, or supercharged engines, have more volume in them (aka...displacement). So yeah, back up right there.
I never said how long the crank would last, did I? I just said it will last up there. I'm sure with some filleting on the journals and some upgraded bearings you could hit 750 as well. Again, it may not last long, but it will not spit a rod out of the block as you make it sound (immediately would be my interpritation).
Blown motors eh? Ever think that tuning has an effect on the lifetime of a motor? Gee....tune it just a little too lean, run it hard, and you WILL run into problems.
Posts: 16
Joined: 4/3/2003 From: United States Status: offline
Quote: Originally posted by jeep45238 on 10 April 2003 Wanna get technical? A turbo engine isn't what the rated displacement is. Ask any engineer, turbo, or supercharged engines, have more volume in them (aka...displacement). So yeah, back up right there.
WRONG. just because your pumping more air into an engine via turbo/superch/n2o, that doesnt increase its rated displacement, it just adds more oxygen to the fire. that arguement makes absolutely no sense, and it would be a good laugh to hear an engineer set you straight.
Quote: I never said how long the crank would last, did I? I just said it will last up there. I'm sure with some filleting on the journals and some upgraded bearings you could hit 750 as well.
well then, it wouldnt be stock anymore would it?? your condradicting yourself there. the 5.0 is a weak motor stock, that was my only point. its not gonna last like the z motor can stock. also the e heads on the 5.0 dont flow worth a sh*t, and the z heads are like something off a ferrari. that was my only point. RESPECT THAT.
Quote: Blown motors eh? Ever think that tuning has an effect on the lifetime of a motor? Gee....tune it just a little too lean, run it hard, and you WILL run into problems.
ok that was my point?? i dont get why your repeating me? if you wanna pull 500+ hp your gonna have to tune, and run it hard. the z motor will handle it better than the 5.0. PERIOD.
my main point of argueing is just to say its idiotic to just act like domestic v8's are the one and only performance choice people have. you people act like if its imported its crap just because of your experiences with 17 second civics with fart cans. there are fast imports, and they are well engineered and very strong vehicles. learn to respect that, or look like a fool when a little volkwagon, nissan, toyota, hell even honda blows your doors off. cause if you race, its prolly gonna happen.
it reminds me of when it was better to get a c4 ford transmission with a J stamping on it b/c they lasted longer and were made in japan. you cant argue with the better quality japan made motors come from the factory with these days.
Posts: 43
Joined: 2/28/2003 From: United States Status: offline
I agree with you in that if you race enough you are bound to lose eventually to someone. However, of all the years of "street" racing I've done, not once have I seen a souped up "front" driver take out a souped up V8 domestic. If the day ever comes(still waiting..) that a rice rocket blows my doors off, I will pull back up next to him and give him a thumbs up. I respect the cars that are built but where are all the 10/11 second imports? I'm not talking about gutted drag cars w/slicks at the track. True street drivers.. I live in North Cal and I don't see them here.
Posts: 16
Joined: 4/3/2003 From: United States Status: offline
i personally dont care about the fwd imports either, and they are few and far between. all im pointing out is dont judge all imports by their example. its easy as bolt-ons to get supra's, 300zx's, rx7's, dsm's, vr4's into the 11's. ive outran souped up supercharged 5.0's on the interstate plenty of times with a mildly modded 300zx, so it is possible
Posts: 43
Joined: 2/28/2003 From: United States Status: offline
Everyone is partial to their brand of vehicle and we are in a "Mustang" forum. Of course people are going to protect what they drive. I'm cool with any fast car regardless of what it is. I chose Mustang because it's cheap, parts are massively abundant, and power is very easy to come by. Have you priced a used Supra lately? No thanks. And upgrading turbos,computer,etc? That's out of my league. It's like the old saying goes "speed costs money. how fast you wanna go?". You've got a 351 Stang..come on and help us rag on the imports...
Just to show you I'm impressed with imports potential power. Check out this link to some cool video's. Especially the 10.69 quarter mile blast in a stock looking Supra. Now that's cool!
Posts: 16
Joined: 4/3/2003 From: United States Status: offline
personally i hate ricers. i make fun of the 17 second fart machines just like any other mustang/domestic/fast import owner. however im not cocky enough to think that there arent imports out there that can compete with me like some people seem to think that posted on this thread. i'll admit there are prolly 1000 fast mustangs to every one fast import, but thats kinda what makes them cool to me. they are rare, especially the z's, 7's, ect, and are almost like luxery cars on the inside, but pure performance on the outside. cool cars, you dont see as much as you do mustangs.
i have a mustang for about the same reasons as you, its pretty cheap, and easy to go fast in a mustang, and damn easy to work on. but if it was all about how fast you can go for xx amount of dollars easily, i would be driving a chevy. you kinda get what im sayin? its not all about 1/4 performance per dollar to some people. to some its a good mix of style, perf, and cost. thats why alot of people like mustangs instead of an ugly late model camaro (imo maybe not yours). or a good handling fast import, instead of a straight line mustang.
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Joined: 3/31/2003 From: United States Status: offline
Wooo...doesn't make sense? LOL
Take a given room that's sealed off. A bathroom for example, that has 30 cubic feet of air in it sea level. That's 1 bar of pressure. Now, force in enough air to raise the pressure to 19 overall bar. That's an additional 18 bar. More volume, technically. So in a sense, the displacement does increase, even though the size of an engine stays the same.
I know that domestic V8's are not the only performance option. BUT, in MY eyes, they are the best.
Posts: 16
Joined: 4/3/2003 From: United States Status: offline
Quote: Originally posted by jeep45238 on 10 April 2003 Wooo...doesn't make sense? LOL
Take a given room that's sealed off. A bathroom for example, that has 30 cubic feet of air in it sea level. That's 1 bar of pressure. Now, force in enough air to raise the pressure to 19 overall bar. That's an additional 18 bar. More volume, technically. So in a sense, the displacement does increase, even though the size of an engine stays the same
your not making any sense right now. displacement of an engine is the volume a piston displaces in a single stroke. now when i say volume, that could be air, water, solid matter, whatever. volume is a space plain and simple. you just can fill that space with more air, than you can say a solid, or liquid. the thing about air is its made up of very spread apart atoms that can be compressed easily, unlike water, or solid matter. that means you can stuff more air into any given space,and that is what raises the pressure, but your NOT changing the displacement, only the space between the atoms of the several elements that make up our atmosphere. you understand yet, or do i need to school you some more? no hard feelings man, you just need to learn more about what your talking about.
Quote: I know that domestic V8's are not the only performance option. BUT, in MY eyes, they are the best.
nobody ever said they werent. im just saying dont put down the little v6's, I6's that outrun you. ever heard of the buik gnx?? its a domestic v6 that will own your v8 with the right mods. a smaller lighter car with a lighter v6/I6 is alot of fun. you should actually drive one, instead of bench racing them online, and maybe you would gain a little RESPECT.
Posts: 31
Joined: 3/30/2003 From: United States Status: offline
Quote: Originally posted by jeep45238 on 10 April 2003 Wooo...doesn't make sense? LOL
Take a given room that's sealed off. A bathroom for example, that has 30 cubic feet of air in it sea level. That's 1 bar of pressure. Now, force in enough air to raise the pressure to 19 overall bar. That's an additional 18 bar. More volume, technically. So in a sense, the displacement does increase, even though the size of an engine stays the same.
I know that domestic V8's are not the only performance option. BUT, in MY eyes, they are the best.
Wait a second...so a turbocharger will turn my 1.8L into a 2.4!?!?!? :D
Uh...no. =)
dis·place·ment P Pronunciation Key (ds-plsmnt)
The volume displaced by a single stroke of a piston in an engine or pump.
vol·ume P Pronunciation Key (vlym, -ym)
The amount of space occupied by a three-dimensional object or region of space, expressed in cubic units.
The capacity of such a region or of a specified container, expressed in cubic units.
Posts: 282
Joined: 3/7/2003 From: United States Status: offline
I understand what jeep's saying though. It's hard to explain into words. You put more air into an engine, it's goinna produce more power. The thing is, a lot of those cars NEED forced induction to get the hp numbers they get. And as far as the argument about I4's and V6's having less cylinders and still able to keep up with a Mustang, put a turbo onto a 5.0 and then try that race again. It's comparing apples and oranges. Also, everybody here knows that Ford choked the stangs as far as the heads and intake go. Performance isn't based only on # of cylinders. Everybody knows that given equal flowing heads and intake, a V8 will take a V6/I4 any day.
Besides, a lot of the imports in question are geared to get that performance, and you're comparing this to a stock Mustang, which comes with 2.73's. Those in itself are a power robber. This argument really has to many factors to really say which are better, it's all pretty much based on opinions
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Joined: 3/31/2003 From: United States Status: offline
The volume of air in the engine is increased, even though the size of the engine stays the same.
Damn, I thought I put it into simple words. Guess not. I do know what I am talking about, and apparently, you failed to see it from my side of the fence.
Posts: 708
Joined: 2/14/2003 From: United States Status: offline
Its the not the imports and chevys that we hate, its the assclowns that drive them that we hate.
This argument is so pathetic that everyone in this forum is now dumber for having read it. I award you all no points and may God have mercy on your souls.
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300zx vs gt, winner? - 
