for a little 4 banger that thing was hanging pretty nice... even if it is an LT1 but the question is how much did it hurt his wallet to get it to that speed... I say it's a deadly little car for something like I have, but at the end of the day it still sounds like he has the whole 7th division armed with weedwackers under the hood
for a little 4 banger that thing was hanging pretty nice... even if it is an LT1 but the question is how much did it hurt his wallet to get it to that speed... I say it's a deadly little car for something like I have, but at the end of the day it still sounds like he has the whole 7th division armed with weedwackers under the hood
96-00 Civic - 3-6k
b18b - 3k
DIY turbo / Kit - 1k to 3k
tops? 12k... maybe. Who knows, I would like some background information on the LT1 myself. It could have been modded and in the 13s for all we know.
Team MF Member #2046 Posts: 12516
Joined: 1/22/2004 From: United States Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: 2000Si
quote:
ORIGINAL: bharsen
for a little 4 banger that thing was hanging pretty nice... even if it is an LT1 but the question is how much did it hurt his wallet to get it to that speed... I say it's a deadly little car for something like I have, but at the end of the day it still sounds like he has the whole 7th division armed with weedwackers under the hood
96-00 Civic - 3-6k
b18b - 3k
DIY turbo / Kit - 1k to 3k
tops? 12k... maybe. Who knows, I would like some background information on the LT1 myself. It could have been modded and in the 13s for all we know.
So you spend 12K on a car, mostly right out of pocket, and you have at the best a mid 14 second car? If the LT1 was running high 13s the civic wouldn't have at the strip (with a 2.2 60')
You could do all that, or just buy a LT1/PI 4.6 and run that stock, with a far more streetable and reilable setup. (stock car vs motor swapped turbo'd car).
Seriously, if your not gonna buy a WRX or evo I don't see what the point is. If you can't launch it on the street, espcially if you make any real power, whats the point? What are you gonna do, go prowl the highways on friday nights???
Are you really that convinced that FWD cars with 200 whp can't launch well? There comes a time when you have to realize that they make some nice street legal DRs for Civics too.
Seriously. I know launching a VERY high hp FWD car will be difficult, but a 2300 lb Civic hatch doesn't need more than 250 WHEEL hp to run 13s.
Seriously, do you think everyone wants to have a car payment or high insurance from having a V8 or newer EVO/WRX?
Last I checked having a 400 hp RWD car on street tires is hard to launch in and of itself. That doesn't mean they don't make sticky tires for that application.
Get your head out of your ass 2000GT, you're a smart guy. You should be able to figure out WHY people choose to buy and build what they want. Besides that fun stuff, all I did was give an ESTIMATE of what it could cost if the person doing the build isn't a Full out tech head DIY'er. Not to mention you have no idea how fast it really is. Was he running low boost? What kind of turbo did he source? You can't sit here and talk down about it because of what you think he's running vs an LT1 that you have no idea of what it's possible mods are.
Assumptions make you look like an ass.
Take CivicSleeper, I believe his setup cost him probably around 6 grand total (if I remember right... including the cost of the car).
Can you do that with your 2000 GT? um... nope. sorry.
< Message edited by 2000Si -- 5/21/2006 6:28:05 PM >
Team MF Member #2046 Posts: 12516
Joined: 1/22/2004 From: United States Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: 2000Si
Are you really that convinced that FWD cars with 200 whp can't launch well? There comes a time when you have to realize that they make some nice street legal DRs for Civics too.
Seriously. I know launching a VERY high hp FWD car will be difficult, but a 2300 lb Civic hatch doesn't need more than 250 WHEEL hp to run 13s.
Seriously, do you think everyone wants to have a car payment or high insurance from having a V8 or newer EVO/WRX?
Last I checked having a 400 hp RWD car on street tires is hard to launch in and of itself. That doesn't mean they don't make sticky tires for that application.
Get your head out of your ass 2000GT, you're a smart guy. You should be able to figure out WHY people choose to buy and build what they want. Besides that fun stuff, all I did was give an ESTIMATE of what it could cost if the person doing the build isn't a Full out tech head DIY'er. Not to mention you have no idea how fast it really is. Was he running low boost? What kind of turbo did he source? You can't sit here and talk down about it because of what you think he's running vs an LT1 that you have no idea of what it's possible mods are.
Assumptions make you look like an ass.
Take CivicSleeper, I believe his setup cost him probably around 6 grand total (if I remember right... including the cost of the car).
Can you do that with your 2000 GT? um... nope. sorry.
Show me ONE 13 second GT vs 13 second civic video where they race on the street, from a stop, and the GT loses. Hell, lets see a civic video with any appreciable power racing from a stop.
Take the escort guys over there on that forum. The fastest guy that acutally has video evidence to prove it is running like 300 WHP at 19 PSI or thereabouts. He was running 26 PSI at the track and can't break into the 13s. His 60' on street tires was a 2.5!!!
I can say one thing about my GT, in all of the time I have owned it, I have never backed down from a race, and I lost/tied plenty of them. And I have never lost to anything with less than 8 cyl from a stop, unless its AWD. I know it could easily be done, and i know there is probably someone ready to say "come down to xx and I will wax your ass" but that must say something about the 4cyl vs v8 arguement.
And don't talk to me about total money invested, thats ricer bs. I can take a foxbody and make it run pretty dammed fast too for 6 grand. Hell, MM&FF had a bone stock car except the 4,000 dollar hellion kit and a new trans run 10s, and it could hook on the street.
And btw, your gonna run drag radials on your DD FWD car? I don't think so. I would hafve seen your funeral notice the first time it rained and you were on the highway.
Add on top of all of this, who wants to drive around a motor swapped aftermarket boosted 13 second car????? If I had to swap the motor and add boost to run 13s I would drive the car off a cliff and take up bingo.
Add on top of all of this, who wants to drive around a motor swapped aftermarket boosted 13 second car????? If I had to swap the motor and add boost to run 13s I would drive the car off a cliff and take up bingo.
That's funny, cause you had to add boost to run 13s... isn't a vortech kit just about as much as a b18b? haha
Give it up... you know jack **** about Hondas yet still continue to talk like you do. It gets tiring listening to the same nonsense come from you day after day.
Who says these cars are some of these guys daily drivers? Christ. I guess because someone owns and modifies a Honda they're not rich enough to have 2 or more cars?
quote:
And don't talk to me about total money invested, thats ricer bs. I can take a foxbody and make it run pretty dammed fast too for 6 grand. Hell, MM&FF had a bone stock car except the 4,000 dollar hellion kit and a new trans run 10s, and it could hook on the street.
No, no you won't run 10s and still be able to hook on the street. Not without DOT approved DRs... but then I'd like to see you drive on the highway the first time it rains.
Team MF Member #2046 Posts: 12516
Joined: 1/22/2004 From: United States Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: 2000Si
quote:
Add on top of all of this, who wants to drive around a motor swapped aftermarket boosted 13 second car????? If I had to swap the motor and add boost to run 13s I would drive the car off a cliff and take up bingo.
That's funny, cause you had to add boost to run 13s... isn't a vortech kit just about as much as a b18b? haha
Give it up... you know jack **** about Hondas yet still continue to talk like you do. It gets tiring listening to the same nonsense come from you day after day.
Who says these cars are some of these guys daily drivers? Christ. I guess because someone owns and modifies a Honda they're not rich enough to have 2 or more cars?
quote:
And don't talk to me about total money invested, thats ricer bs. I can take a foxbody and make it run pretty dammed fast too for 6 grand. Hell, MM&FF had a bone stock car except the 4,000 dollar hellion kit and a new trans run 10s, and it could hook on the street.
No, no you won't run 10s and still be able to hook on the street. Not without DOT approved DRs... but then I'd like to see you drive on the highway the first time it rains.
Pull your foot out of your mouth 2000.
First of all, where did this come from? I never claimed to know alot about hondas, and more often than not I am the one defending the poor ricer when everyone is picking on em.
I didn't have to add boost to run 13s by any amount. My car was high 12s capable N/A! I added boost to go 11s on drag raidals, and mid 11s on slicks.
Just for the sake of argument, lets replace "daily drivers" with "streetable cars that can race from a stop".
And my car, while not exactly a daily driver, gets driven in the rain with drag radials on it fairly often. (and has for 3+ years) Point being is that it doesn't have drag radials on the STEERING tires.
Seriously, lets get down to brass tacks here. The LT1 didn't even have a aftermarket exhaust, whats the chance its running any better than a 14.0 or so on average? And from a ROLL the mighty motor swapped/turbo'd civic gets waxed. If that civic runs a 14.50 he is doing well.
So, your motor swapped/turbo'd car that you have put all of this work and time in cannot win a drag race with a stock auto GT from a stop. Doesn't that make you just feel like it was all worth it????
Add on to all of this, your driving a car that orginally was intended as a economy car like a performance car, with far more horsepower than it was ever designed to handle (frame/drivetrain/brakes/suspension). At least the V8 and WRX/EVO cars are built with performance in mind.
Once again I use the escort guys as an example. The guy has a 300+ RWHP car that wieghs 2500 pounds, but its got tiny little brake rotors, he can't run anything stickyer than a regular raidal at the strip without tearing out the trans, its simply too much for the car.
< Message edited by 2000GT4.6 -- 5/21/2006 10:30:42 PM >
Seriously, lets get down to brass tacks here. The LT1 didn't even have a aftermarket exhaust, whats the chance its running any better than a 14.0 or so on average? And from a ROLL the mighty motor swapped/turbo'd civic gets waxed. If that civic runs a 14.50 he is doing well.
So, your motor swapped/turbo'd car that you have put all of this work and time in cannot win a drag race with a stock auto GT from a stop. Doesn't that make you just feel like it was all worth it????
What is the whole basis on your arguement? You're making wild claims about a car and a race you know nothing about. OH OH THE Z28 doesn't have aftermarket exhaust! holy **** that makes a difference! Cause you need new exhaust to possibly spray, or have a blower! right? yeah. Don't think so.
I've watched videos of swapped turbo'd cars running 12s and being daily driven mop the floor with LS1s and modified GTs. But of course being on a Mustang board you have a biased opinion because everyone here is too scared to post being killed by anything less that domestic muscle.
My point behind all this is you have no idea what's done, and hell we don't even know if that Civic is swapped or not. But your arguement is based all around biased opinions and your personal assumptions. Good for you. You don't know what you're talking about.
Team MF Member #2046 Posts: 12516
Joined: 1/22/2004 From: United States Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: 2000Si
quote:
Seriously, lets get down to brass tacks here. The LT1 didn't even have a aftermarket exhaust, whats the chance its running any better than a 14.0 or so on average? And from a ROLL the mighty motor swapped/turbo'd civic gets waxed. If that civic runs a 14.50 he is doing well.
So, your motor swapped/turbo'd car that you have put all of this work and time in cannot win a drag race with a stock auto GT from a stop. Doesn't that make you just feel like it was all worth it????
What is the whole basis on your arguement? You're making wild claims about a car and a race you know nothing about. OH OH THE Z28 doesn't have aftermarket exhaust! holy **** that makes a difference! Cause you need new exhaust to possibly spray, or have a blower! right? yeah. Don't think so.
I've watched videos of swapped turbo'd cars running 12s and being daily driven mop the floor with LS1s and modified GTs. But of course being on a Mustang board you have a biased opinion because everyone here is too scared to post being killed by anything less that domestic muscle.
My point behind all this is you have no idea what's done, and hell we don't even know if that Civic is swapped or not. But your arguement is based all around biased opinions and your personal assumptions. Good for you. You don't know what you're talking about.
well, since you seem to know everything about em and all, you should be able to tell us about how fast that car should be with that swap and setup.
The LT1 looked and sounded stock to me. Even the catback sounded stock, who runs around on a 12 second car with a stock catback?
Plus, they just wern't going thru the gears that fast. Its pretty easy to tell how fast a car is by how often they are shifting. I bet the LT1 had a K&N at best.
So whats a motor swapped/turbo car worth will full weight and a street tire?? Enlighten us.
You can't tell me its gonna go much faster than mid/high 13s with what he has done and a street tire.
Theres a guy up in my hometown with a civic that runs mid 12s on slicks. And he runs mid 14s on street tires. And on the street, he gets beat by stock GTs.....
Honestly, you telling me if you want to build a good streetable setup to drive on the weekends and get in the ocassional street race with, your gonna build a FWD turbo car??? Seriously.......
< Message edited by 2000GT4.6 -- 5/21/2006 11:06:36 PM >
It's been done, you just have to learn how to drive. It doesn't take that much skill to keep a high hp high redlining car from spinning off a launch. It's called not revving the piss out of it and dumping the clutch.
What's all this about? Is this about cost? Because you didn't start this shenanigans until I ESTIMATED costs.
It's seemingly obvious that even with your intelligence you won't understand the point of preference. Ever.
Team MF Member #2046 Posts: 12516
Joined: 1/22/2004 From: United States Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: 2000Si
It's been done, you just have to learn how to drive. It doesn't take that much skill to keep a high hp high redlining car from spinning off a launch. It's called not revving the piss out of it and dumping the clutch.
What's all this about? Is this about cost? Because you didn't start this shenanigans until I ESTIMATED costs.
It's seemingly obvious that even with your intelligence you won't understand the point of preference. Ever.
The point here is that no matter what, you will always have problems hooking up no matter what tire you run. You can't run slicks on the street, and I can only imagine what running a drag raidal on the front tires is like (nightmare)
The point is you have a motor swap and a turbo done, and at least this guy can't even dream of hitting 13s.
The point is your in an economy car with 300+ WHP. Its simply doing something it was never intended to do. My GT was certainly no race car from the factory, but I am running a dead stock suspension and brake setup and its doing a pretty decent job. I don't think you can say this about a civic DX.
The point is, everyone IS allowed to have their opinion. In my opinion there isn't much appeal, and i don't see what people see in it. From my point of view, all you have done is throw alot of time and money into a car, and your still getting beat by 14 second cars. It sounds like ****, it's not too streetable, its overpowered, and you can't race anyone from a stop. Whats the fun in that? What can I do with it on friday night??
Once more, the escort guys. I have some resepect for them, and I think its great he runs around whipping people with a freaking escort. But I would never build one. Look at all that he has invested in it, and its still not even a 13 second car. And thats simply not enough to get it done anymore.
< Message edited by 2000GT4.6 -- 5/21/2006 11:29:07 PM >
The point is you have a motor swap and a turbo done, and at least this guy can't even dream of hitting 13s.
Once more, the escort guys. I have some resepect for them, and I think its great he runs around whipping people with a freaking escort. But I would never build one. Look at all that he has invested in it, and its still not even a 13 second car. And thats simply not enough to get it done anymore.
You're too funny.
First sentence: How do you know that? I've seen quite a few people with just a turbo kit and suspension pop thirteens all day on street tires in their Civics.
Go to Hondaswap, or Honda-tech. You'll find hundreds of 13, 12 and 11 second Civics and Integras. Yes, street legal and some daily driven. You just don't get the point. It's possible, but not everyone wants one.
I don't even care about the Escort part of this. The aftermarket for those cars is TINY as hell. There's only one place that sells worth while modifications, and they don't even have a broad selection.
It's been done, you just have to learn how to drive. It doesn't take that much skill to keep a high hp high redlining car from spinning off a launch. It's called not revving the piss out of it and dumping the clutch.
What's all this about? Is this about cost? Because you didn't start this shenanigans until I ESTIMATED costs.
It's seemingly obvious that even with your intelligence you won't understand the point of preference. Ever.
Good post.. except the part about taking skill to not spin a high power FWD car.. from my experience at the track and what I have seen it looks like it takes a TON of skill to get a good launch out of FWD, very rarely have I seen it happen.
But for the most part I agree with you, preference IS a huge part of it, and seems to be overlooked by some others here.
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